World Cup Preview - Argentina

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World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby sussexpob » Thu May 08, 2014 12:11 pm

Gonzalo Higuaín was born in Brest, but no Argentinian football fan refers to him as “the Frenchman”. The Napoli hitman, a former River Plate youngster who once bagged a brace against rivals Boca in what is arguably the world’s most fiercely contested football match aged only 17, may also have left Argentina before he grew into a full adult, but is in no question considered to be “Argentinian”. In the middle to late years of his teens he had played a part for one of the nation’s most popular and high profile teams, his 12million Euro transfer fee had helped River avoid bankruptcy for a few more years, and although he was not granted citizenship to the country till 2 years into his residency in Madrid, his impact from a footballing and emotional level left an imprint on Argentine footballing hearts. Higuain was “one of us”.

There is no such grace given to Lionel Messi. Despite being born in Rosario, the locals refer to him as “The Catalan”; a moniker designed to distance themselves away from their compatriot. Despite being the world’s most cherished footballer, Messi has never captured the imagination of the Argentine public. Maradona and others had to first beat the slums like Villa Fiorito they grew up in, Lionel went from a leafy, middle class suburban University town most famous for producing Argentina’s most famous political thinker, to the protection and education of a European footballing giant in his late pre-teens.

While Maradona also played for Barcelona in his early 20’s, he had already become a legend at the most popular working class club in Argentina, Boca Juniors, scoring 142 goals in six seasons. In Maradona, the Argentine public found a troubled, yet easily understandable and identifiable character shared in themselves; in Messi they see a person with a Catalan accent, a sporting and personal character built outside his homeland, and an iconic status build and shared with the world, but not exclusively or specifically related to the Argentinian.

It is fair to say that Messi has never quite mirrored his quality in Spain on the pitch for Argentina. This, combined with the weariness shown to him by his compatriots, has often meant underachievement for Argentina while Messi has been at his pomp. Nevertheless, it would be unfair and obtuse to put this solely on Lionel’s shoulders; without the trust in his ability, and the frank admission of his world beating talent, Argentina have never embraced Messi as the “win-all” go-to guy they should have., instead placing him into a poorly thought out system that has never helped get the best out of him, or those around him.

When Maradona won Argentina the 1986 World Cup, and took them to the final in 1990, his talent was considered so immense that Argentina’s tactics and squad were built round him. If a player couldn’t fit inside Maradona’s system, they weren’t even considered, despite their talents. It was a tactic that worked for Argentina, building a disciplined and unglamorous team around the creative and technical capacity of the world’s greatest football, who pulled strings and killed teams at his whim. Had Argentina not lost their discipline in 1990 when faced with the ultra-efficient Germans, they may have won another world cup under him, such was his genius.

After Maradona’s rise and fall, Argentina are yet to find another successful tactical blueprint, or build a cohesive plan around the players at their disposal. It is for this reason that Argentina have wandered in the dark slightly in the last two decades, failing to achieve the high standards they are capable of. Bielsa tried to bring in a cohesive tactical plan, but was wrecked by the expectations brought by a failing domestic economy (Sabre Veron would be on record saying that the 2002 Economic Crash meant Argentina may as well not return home without the trophy if they didn’t win) and a squad full of temperamental talent blended with the failing careers of their star players.

In 2006, Pekerman would famously leave out Samuel and Zanetti, considered at the time to two of the World’s best defenders, and try to build a team around a tragic experimentation formula that was inconsistent and at times very unpopular. He dropped senior players, made tactical changes for each game despite previous success, and in the world of International football when little time is given to knitting a team, the fall out was never going to be successful. The brawl at the end of the Germany 2006 game, which seen them exit the tournament, summed up his messy reign as coach. Maradona continued the instability, often choosing left field picks such as the 36 year old Martin Palermo for the last world cup, and squandered what should have been a once in a generation chance to blend proven world class and experienced quality, with a stream of excellent, hungry youth.

One thing that was apparent in Maradona’s thinking was his lack of thought paid to certain areas of the pitch. Maradona believed that the attacking quality of Messi, Higuain, Aguero, Tevez, Pastore, Milito and Di Maria could fuse into a cohesive unit together simply by their quality, while picking a defence that was experimental and subpar. The icing on the cake was picking a 36 year old Veron on the basis that his creative ability could bring those players into dangerous positions, even though his star had burnt out many a year previous, and his slow, lumbering play off the ball, combined with his failing passing, set the tone for Argentina. In Messi, Maradona should have understood he had a player like himself; a man inside which a team should be based around, but Maradona could not resist the temptation of building a team round his best on paper names, with no thought on how they fit into a system. They flattered to deceive, and Messi has footed most of the emotional scorn since.

Sabella, Argentina’s current coach, has to a certain extent learned some lessons of his predecessors, and attempted to dissuaded from picking a squad crammed with personal talent, but little uniformity. After an initial bad start, Argentina managed the rare feat of qualifying from the South America group with games to spare. Under his new system he plays a 4-3-3, with a midfield tackler in Mascherano, and a defensive ball playing midfielder in Fernando Gago. Together these have added solidarity in the middle of the park and help shield and make up for a porous backline, Mascherano ‘s experience playing as a central defender in La Liga giving him an excellent understanding of defence positioning and the mental responsibility he once lacked in midfield. In Gago, they have a hard working and intelligent midfield with the skills to drop back and defend, or support on the counter attack, when needed.

Forward of these players is the attacking prowess of Messi, playing in the pocket behind Aguero and Higuain when both are fit, a forward central three which would give most teams nightmares. On the flanks, Di Maria and Lavezzi add pace and directness, and are both hard-working players, on the right supported by the hard working Zabaleta, they will open up space in defences for the men I the centre to exploit. Evan Banega is a much used central midfield to add depth, and has proved a very compact and precise passer when needed. And for their lack in quality in defence, they have at least made up for this by having a cohesive midfield.

The initial indications has shown that playing around Messi and being persuaded to leave out talents like Pastore and Tevez, who just don’t fit into the system, are positive. Yet like everything in Argentinian football, not everything is as it always should seem. The press have attacked the coaches for not picking Tevez and other stars, and when Tevez was repicked for the 2011 Copa America, the last time he played, the reason was largely down to public/press pressure resulting in a decree from the President of Argentine Football forcing his selection. Not long after that the Bayern Munich incident happened, and his footballing reputation meant he silently fell into international wilderness.

Yet Italian football is very popular in Argentina, Tevez is a hero domestically and has always been popular for his “take it, or leave it attitude to the press” combined with his hard working personality, and his form for Juventus has been brilliant since departing Man City. The storm clouds are already brewing about the potential for this to overtake the Argentina Camp’s World Cup preparations, just like in 2011. To include Tevez would be to fall in the trap that has haunted Argentina for two decades, picking divisive characters who do not sing from the same team ethic, but to not pick him is to ignore a fantastic, on form player! With questions on Aguero and Messi’s latest fitness issues, and with Gago struggling and being such an essential cog in their system, can Argentina afford to ignore what would clearly be an excellent plan B player?

All in all, this may well be one world cup too soon for this Argentina side. While they have a tactical plan that is there to get the best out of the team, they may struggle to have the quality in many areas of the field to implement it, and should injury and tiredness take hold, there is little recognizable quality in the 23 man squad that Sabella has called upon recently that can plug the gaps. While playing not taking Tevez and Pastore may work in tactical sense, if Messi and Aguero get injured, and both have spent a while out this season, then it’s hard to argue that these are the next best players in a tactical, as well as technical sense, to replace them.

It’s almost that these two, and other players that have been ignored and supplanted with a few lesser known domestic players, are almost the “elephants in the room” of Argentine football. While their talent cannot be ignored, you cannot fall into bad habits when you are not surrounded by them, and much like a recovering alcoholic who can’t sit in the pub and drink responsibly, Sabella will simply abstain from picking them, rather than open a pandora’s box in taking them.

If Sabella’s tactics can get the best out of the forward three, Argentina could storm this world cup. If Sabella’s cannot unlock the mystery question of getting the best out of his immense core of talent, Argentina will crumble very badly. I cant see any middle ground for Argentina, it’s sink or swim…. I still fade towards the “sink” argument.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby Gingerfinch » Thu May 08, 2014 12:20 pm

Nice write up as ever, sussex. Regarding Messi. Remember Maradona was roughly the same age as Messi is now, when he won the world cup in 86, and for me, Messi has done as much or more up this point than Maradona had done, at the same age. Messi though, has a bit to prove.

Argentina have the players to score goals, and possibly win it, and with it being in South America, it's a good opportunity to do so.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby dan08 » Thu May 08, 2014 3:50 pm

Their front 5 of Higuain, Aguero, Messi, Banega, Di Maria is exceptional but i'm not sure about their back 6 of Mascherano, Rojo, Garay, Fernandez, Zabaleta, Romero.

Mascherano's had a poor season but usually performs better at CDM, Garay has been great whenever i've seen him for Benfica, Zabaleta is of course one of the best RBs in the world but don't know whether Rojo, Fernandez and Romero are of good enough quality to win them the World Cup.

Romero's played 1 league game all season as sub goalie for Monaco, Willy Caballero would be a better pick but Sabella always ignores him.

I think they've got a great squad, i'm not sure they'll win but they'd definitely be in my top 3.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby SaintPowelly » Thu May 08, 2014 5:02 pm

I think it will come down to Argentina and Uruguay.

Aguerro remaining fit will be crucial to them.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby yuppie » Thu May 08, 2014 7:03 pm

Good write up SP

Argentina also have good venues for their group games, not heading north once into the heat. Could be a deciding factor as the tournament goes on.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby mikesiva » Fri May 09, 2014 10:05 am

A brilliant write-up, SP....
:bow:
Better than any piece I will read on Argentina in the media in the weeks leading up to the World Cup, I'm willing to bet.

I tend to agree that while the Argies have arguably the best attacking line-up, their defence is what will probably let them down at the business end of the tournament.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby sussexpob » Tue May 13, 2014 10:13 am

Dr Robert wrote:Nice write up as ever, sussex. Regarding Messi. Remember Maradona was roughly the same age as Messi is now, when he won the world cup in 86, and for me, Messi has done as much or more up this point than Maradona had done, at the same age. Messi though, has a bit to prove


In Argentina, they would argue that Maradona did much more. There is a resistance in Argentina towards European football, being such an established nation themselves that produces so much talent (in terms of population, and how many players end abroad, they cant be beaten on that) , they naturally feel that in order to gain respect in the country, you have had to do something in their domestic game. When Messi hasn't turned up for Argentina, mostly down to their catastrophic management decisions in selection and tactics, this only heightens the suspicion they have about his game.

One of the top football journalists in Argentina is very scathing about Messi, and he said recently something to the effect of "if he wants respect, all he needs to do is play 5 matches in the Clausera". Its seems ridiculously fickle, but that is South American culture. They play to only win, they only show an interest in things that are personal to them, and Messi so far hasn't satisfied that. He won the Ballon D'Or and World Player of the Year multiple times in a row, but until he bangs in a late winner for Old Boys vs All Boys in a bottom of the league Argentine clash, he may as well be slaying goblins in Middle Earth.

The result is, they never have taken the standpoint "how do we get Messi to play to his best".... its always been about someone else, or how to get all their talent to fire.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby sussexpob » Tue May 13, 2014 10:17 am

SaintPowelly wrote:I think it will come down to Argentina and Uruguay.

Aguerro remaining fit will be crucial to them.


The main man in this team is Gago or Mascherano. Even if Messi gets injured, you can replace him with quality. Gago, at the moment injured, might not make the initial group stages, and that's a huge blow for them. After Gago/Mascherano and Banega, they struggle to replace quality in the middle of the park.

Aguero being injured opens the door for Tevez is it happens, or Lavezzi can play their and others fill in on the wing.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby sussexpob » Tue May 13, 2014 10:28 am

Argentina also have good venues for their group games, not heading north once into the heat. Could be a deciding factor as the tournament goes on.


I think the idea that South American teams will be better with the heat is, quite simply, wrong. South American football has always favoured the home team heavily, it wasn't that long ago since Argentina got smashed 6-0 away to Bolivia, who finished bottom of qualification.

In short, football is huge in Rosario and Buenos Aires province, that is where essentially all but two of the professional teams come from, and both of which are possibly colder than Southern Europe in summer, by quite some distance as well. The only place in Argentina it gets to serious temperatures is in places like Salta and Mendoza in the very North West Central areas, and these are footballing ghost cities. The temperature, on average, never gets over 30 degrees in Buenos Aires even in summer (and if it does, only in the hottest periods, and only just). Argentina wont have any climatic advantage over the Mediterranean teams at all.

In fact, the only team that wont struggle with Brazil is Paraguay, because it mirrors Brazil's climate the best. In the history of South America football, Brazil only really do well on the flat and hot, Argentina and Chile in the moderate, Colombia, Bolivia, Peru and Venezuela in the high altitude.

If the climate factors, it only serves to highlight Brazil as the overwhelming favourites.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby yuppie » Tue May 13, 2014 1:20 pm

sussexpob wrote:
Argentina also have good venues for their group games, not heading north once into the heat. Could be a deciding factor as the tournament goes on.


I think the idea that South American teams will be better with the heat is, quite simply, wrong. South American football has always favoured the home team heavily, it wasn't that long ago since Argentina got smashed 6-0 away to Bolivia, who finished bottom of qualification.

In short, football is huge in Rosario and Buenos Aires province, that is where essentially all but two of the professional teams come from, and both of which are possibly colder than Southern Europe in summer, by quite some distance as well. The only place in Argentina it gets to serious temperatures is in places like Salta and Mendoza in the very North West Central areas, and these are footballing ghost cities. The temperature, on average, never gets over 30 degrees in Buenos Aires even in summer (and if it does, only in the hottest periods, and only just). Argentina wont have any climatic advantage over the Mediterranean teams at all.

In fact, the only team that wont struggle with Brazil is Paraguay, because it mirrors Brazil's climate the best. In the history of South America football, Brazil only really do well on the flat and hot, Argentina and Chile in the moderate, Colombia, Bolivia, Peru and Venezuela in the high altitude.

If the climate factors, it only serves to highlight Brazil as the overwhelming favourites.


I was meerly pointing out that Argentina plays all its group games in the south, where it will be colder, and this will help them. Whilst some other teams will be playing their group games in the warmer north(germany). THose playing in the heat will more than likely suffer more tiredness as the tournament progress. This will be an advantage to Argentina.
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby ddb » Wed May 14, 2014 2:02 am

No Tevez in the squad I think?
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby dan08 » Wed May 14, 2014 8:16 am

ddb wrote:No Tevez in the squad I think?

Yep. Hasn't appeared since Sabella became coach in 2011. Don't know why. :dunno
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby yuppie » Wed May 14, 2014 8:50 am

dan08 wrote:
ddb wrote:No Tevez in the squad I think?

Yep. Hasn't appeared since Sabella became coach in 2011. Don't know why. :dunno

Disruptive influence?
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby sussexpob » Wed May 14, 2014 10:34 am

yuppie wrote:
dan08 wrote:
ddb wrote:No Tevez in the squad I think?

Yep. Hasn't appeared since Sabella became coach in 2011. Don't know why. :dunno

Disruptive influence?


It relates to a friendly match in Qatar that Argentina played vs Brazil. Tevez, who was said to be homesick and who was missing his children since his break up with their mother, was spending a lot of time inbetween games going to Argentina to see his family. In 2010/11 season this was supposed to have started to impact on him from a mental level, and he was reaching burn out.

He therefore told the manager that he wouldn't turn up for the friendly, and after that it was decided he wouldn't play. The public, and even the government, went into overdrive and his selection was essentially forced. By this stage though Tevez turned up to the Copa America in 2011 severely unfit, overweight by nearly a stone, and unable to play to his top level. This, and Argentina's general failure, caused a stir afterwards, and the new coach Sabella essentially cut the chord. It was strongly rumoured that Tevez's lack of care had caused serious rifts in the camp, especially with Lionel Messi, who was working himself in the ground to help his country win, and thereby solidify the respect he deserved in his homeland.

After that Tevez's public outburst in the Bayern game occurred, and the whole "never playing for City" issue. I think in hindsight Tevez's personal situation with his family had made him have a breakdown of sorts because, if anything, Tevez can be faulted on many things, but he is one of the hardest working characters in football I have ever seen... by this stage for City, and for Argentina, he was sauntering around half fit and couldn't seem to care less.

Now away from City, and with a more stable personal life, we are seeing just how immense Tevez really is when he is fit and cares.

If Sabella doesn't win, he will never forget not picking Tevez. He is by a far and away the most popular Argentine footballer since Maradona, and already Sabella is copping stick for leaving him out. He will be up for beheading if they get knocked out early!
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Re: World Cup Preview - Argentina

Postby SaintPowelly » Wed May 14, 2014 1:32 pm

sussexpob wrote:Now away from City, and with a more stable personal life, we are seeing just how immense Tevez really is when he is fit and cares.


The Italian league is the most Mickey Mouse competition going, its hard to tell how well he is playing based on that.
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