Second Test. SA v England. Cape Town, Jan 2-6

[Dr Cricket]

im not sure its worth risking jimmy for the next test if he isnt 100% fit now that we are 1-0 up, especially with finn and woakes bowling well in this test

jimmy is 33 now and one serious injury away from potentially retiring i would give him more time and get him fit and firing for the last two tests

2nd test is massive considering that the last test ground that will suit england.
South africa will be massive favourites in the last 2 pacy/bouncy ground.

if SA win the match their be favourites to win the series.

England need to kill South Africa in this test match.

I think England vs India series in 2014 is a good example.
India failed to kill cook and England in Southampton and paid the price after being 1-0 up.
England need to keep SA down and out not give them hope of winning the series in Centurion or Johannesburg.

I be very surprised if England win any of the last two test matches they really need a win or draw here to have a chance to win the series.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Hardus Viljoen called up for the South Africans.

Parents called him after a character in Carry On Cleo.

Averages 25 in fc cricket.

[Dr Cricket]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

[Dr Cricket]

if anyone want proof, be so nice if Nasser Hussain did some research, gonna be so annoying with Nasser and Sky repeating lies just like Pakistan never lost in the UAE lol.
that UAE lies have spread to south african commentators lol.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricke ... ystem.html

[Making_Splinters]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

Cricket South Africa has a guideline on the selection of players saying that at least 4 players of colour need to be considered in the starting line up.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica/content/story/863161.html

[Dr Cricket]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

Cricket South Africa has a guideline on the selection of players saying that at least 4 players of colour need to be considered in the starting line up.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica/content/story/863161.html

that only started recently around near the world cup.
but during 2007-2014 South africa had no clear guidelines to pick team.

[Dr Cricket]

Either way no one can claim the quota system was working because their were number 1 considering they didn't even have the quota system during the time and I don't remember any rift in the team because of it.
Although that not saying their were no outside interference tsakolie sorry for the wrong spelling was kind of forced into the squad and suggestion are that he was going to get games but Smith had none of it and threaten to walk out, but anyway Smith had the team he wanted at all times.
now it is obvious Amla doesn't have the team he want, might explain why they haven't won in 7 test matches.

[Making_Splinters]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

Cricket South Africa has a guideline on the selection of players saying that at least 4 players of colour need to be considered in the starting line up.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica/content/story/863161.html

that only started recently around near the world cup.
but during 2007-2014 South africa had no clear guidelines to pick team.

From what I understand it was formally reintroduced in 2013 at a domestic level, at International level there it is not required that 4 players of colour are in the side but given the wording it is expected that there are.

So the current discussion about it causing issues with selection for the second test is correct.

[Dr Cricket]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

Cricket South Africa has a guideline on the selection of players saying that at least 4 players of colour need to be considered in the starting line up.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica/content/story/863161.html

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica ... 55925.html
march 2015 they still didn't have quota in international cricket, although CSA were obviously were told by government they need 4 colour players in the team was confirmed by lorgat a month later.

Be interesting time in South african cricket considering no one want the quota system.

[Dr Cricket]

they always had quotas in domestic cricket but increased it to 6, 3 blacks.
Nasser articles were just so wrong since they never had quota system after 2007 and he was talking about the national team not the domestic aspect of it.
listening to him on Sky he clearly doesn't really know much about the quota.

Anyway most people are happy with the quotas in domestic cricket it just in national level where the issues arise.

[Dr Cricket]

nasser really doesn't know anything about the quota system.
it got scrapped, they never had it during the time SA had their brilliant spell.
they had it in grassroot levels and franchise level.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricke ... rules.html


during this period they were never forced to pick 4 colour pick or 1 black guy they were loads of time where their only picked 3 in the team.
Reckon their were few times of when only 2 colour players got picked because of injuries.

Cricket South Africa has a guideline on the selection of players saying that at least 4 players of colour need to be considered in the starting line up.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/southafrica/content/story/863161.html

that only started recently around near the world cup.
but during 2007-2014 South africa had no clear guidelines to pick team.

From what I understand it was formally reintroduced in 2013 at a domestic level, at International level there it is not required that 4 players of colour are in the side but given the wording it is expected that there are.

So the current discussion about it causing issues with selection for the second test is correct.

Nasser correct about the 2nd test, he wrong on the reason why he thinks Quotas a good thing, i know you can't change his opinion but listening to him and this article it is clear he doesn't quite know much about quotas fully.
surprised Daily mail didn't do any background research can understand him getting it wrong in live tv but in paper they would do some background research before posting it.
Moonda wrote a good article on the issues Amlas facing can really understand why no cricketer wants quoata in the national team.
Unfair to all cricketers.

[Making_Splinters]

I don't think it is as simple as saying a quota system is right or wrong in South Africa. Given their modern history, there is obviously huge pressures to ensure that the legacy of apartheid is removed as quickly as possible, and cricket is one area where the South African side does not show a truly multicultural face of the rainbow nation.

Obviously, you want the best players to be playing the game, but when 80% of the population have minimal impact on the sport at the top level it is clear that something needs to be done to adress this, the difficult part is how you do that.

That said, the current English side hardly does a good job of representing the ethnography of England and Wales.

[Dr Cricket]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/south-afric ... 56359.html

some of the good quotes from the article.

The obvious change is that Kagiso Rabada will play in place of Dale Steyn, a switch likely to be enforced by injury. Rabada's inclusion gives South Africa another tick in the transformation column which could come in handy if they need to dispense with a player of colour (JP Duminy, for example) but then they have to find a suitable batting reserve. The only replacement batsman in the squad is Rilee Rossouw. Like van Zyl, he is a regular No. 3 but there may be temptation for him to open the batting to give van Zyl a reprieve or he could slot into the middle order.

Why? He could tip the transformation scale the wrong way. If de Kock plays, another batsman has to go. Duminy, unless he saves South Africa in the second innings, seems the obvious candidate. Temba Bavuma, who is the less experienced, is the other. Both are players of colour.

That means that unless Rabada plays, which would require Steyn to stay injured, de Kock's inclusion could come at the cost of a commitment Cricket South Africa made to change. They cannot afford that. They could, however, get creative which would mean Faf du Plessis, who has had single-digit scores in five of his last ten innings, could find himself on the sidelines. That would not be difficult to justify as there is little to choose between him and Duminy when it comes to considering who is contributing but it will rob South Africa of experience.

Again, this is something South Africa may only have to consider after Cape Town when it is more likely that Steyn will be fit. Then they could keep Rabada but Kyle Abbott will have to go in order

If Vernon Philander recovers from his ankle ligament tear then Rabada might make way but only if Bavuma stays so that there is at least one black African in the XI. If something happens to Piedt along the way and Simon Harmer needs to come back in, everything written here must be scrapped and the equation has to start again.

there a reason why no cricketer like the quota in the national team, no person is safe in the team, quota picks feel like their not wanted in the team and not picked by merit, they can be *modded* for 2 years and be guaranteed in the team.
White players always getting dropped even though they should still get a run in the side.
also it is impossible to pick a team.

[backfootpunch]

i bet that south africa feel a little bit silly about having just two days between test matches now

not only did they get thumped
their bowlers are falling apart and their batsmen are devoid of all confidence and have had no chance to work on a few technical flaws or clear their mind

this is a brilliant chance to go 2-0 up in this series

[Dr Cricket]

I don't think it is as simple as saying a quota system is right or wrong in South Africa. Given their modern history, there is obviously huge pressures to ensure that the legacy of apartheid is removed as quickly as possible, and cricket is one area where the South African side does not show a truly multicultural face of the rainbow nation.

Obviously, you want the best players to be playing the game, but when 80% of the population have minimal impact on the sport at the top level it is clear that something needs to be done to adress this, the difficult part is how you do that.

That said, the current English side hardly does a good job of representing the ethnography of England and Wales.

true, but from doing some research and twitter it seem like the government doesn't care about the sport or results but just want black players to play the game.
people that care about the game have said cricket is healthy in SA and loads of black players are coming through but most importantly their coming through sporting schools. even heard from someone on twitter that government have said they don't care if the teams lose they just want to see black people playing.
personally think the government a disgrace they should ask what the cricketers want and it is clear they don't want quota in the national team.

https://twitter.com/JustSportZA/status/ ... 9257506817

That 24 contracted black players come from top cricketing schools shows CSA that transformation comes from investment in youth NOT quotas

Personally think the government should have left it has it was, CSA were doing a good job and domestic cricket had loads of talented black players, bavuma looked quality but sadly not ready yet for international cricket.

I believe the reason government introduce the rules again was because rugby was failing to provide enough black players and were threated to be banned before the world cup last year.
http://mg.co.za/article/2015-08-31-sout ... urt-action
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/30028782

Don't think Cricket needs it enough coloured players pushing for a place, they just need to be picked by merit now.