The Ashes: Australia in England 16th Jun - 31 July

[Arthur Crabtree]

Vaughan and the other BBC commentators, employ the Boycott paradox- you can play your big shots, as long as you don't get out.

Well yes, obviously. But in the real world, there is a balance between risk and reward to be navigated. And the opposition can make your plans look foolish. But if they are suggesting, which they are, that you can only attack from a possition of strength unless you always succeed, then they are saying England need to abandon completely how they currently play.

If they think that if England are a great position, there's no need to take risks, they overlook the fact that they got in that position in the first place by taking risks. It's always at the point a wicket falls that they decide that the method has become stupidly reckless.

And they ignore the incidents when England have consolidated and that hasn't worked.

I think essentially Vaughan etc are disappointed because England are losing, and the commentator is always free to suppose that whatever else they might have done would have been different. But that's just sloppy thinking borne of hurt patriotism.

Vaughan's view should carry weight because he won the Ashes against arguably the greatest side in the history of the game. But all he is actually doing is moaning, which is tough to listen to. He should try bearing the disappointment with dignity.

[Arthur Crabtree]

He's failing the 'If' test. Wheras I don't think England are.

[sussexpob]

Not sure this is anything too new. When England do well, dwelling on ways they could improve are seen as negative. When they do badly, the criticism at times can be a bit bewildering. I think I've made it clear about how certain decisions were bad, but I've also said that in the air of improving the formula, not saying the formula is wrong.

But listening to TMS at stages, in between one test bazball has gone from a masterplan to something terrible. England took to long to suss out Cummins trap the other day, but I am sure they will learn from it. Work in progress.

[sussexpob]

I guess for this series those lessons might have been processed a little late. England should be 2-0 down by tomorrow. But it's easy to forget how bad this team was at the start of last summer.

[alfie]

With respect , Arthur , I don't think that is what Vaughan was saying - at least this week. Certainly isn't the point I am trying to make.

Yes the aggressive style is a "good" idea. And it had them in a strong position Thursday evening. No problem with continuing to attack. The issue was that precisely at the point that Australia - shorn of their "control" bowler in Lyon , and with three of their seamers going at nearly 7 per over - switched to a quite extreme short ball attack , with a mass of fielders in deep catching positions. It looked very much a "last trick in the box" move.

Pope and Duckett took it on , rather sketchily at first. Couple of mishits fell safely , and it was only bringing them singles. Warning flag already perhaps. But OK , Pope tried to really whack one out of the ground , lost his wicket. Then Root comes in , tries - unusually for him - to pull a lifter immediately ; and survives due to a no ball. Surely evidence is mounting up that this isn't the % play at this point ? But three more perished to the short stuff...

I'm betting they would not have played this way a year ago. It isn't against their game plan to dial it back a bit - temporarily - and collect the rewards as the bowlers tire - which they tend to do banging it in short all the time. It's not abandoning their philosophy to look at the field and choose to take the runs that are offering rather than seek to take on all the deep placements. It's just basic cricket common sense.

[alfie]

Not sure this is anything too new. When England do well, dwelling on ways they could improve are seen as negative. When they do badly, the criticism at times can be a bit bewildering. I think I've made it clear about how certain decisions were bad, but I've also said that in the air of improving the formula, not saying the formula is wrong.

But listening to TMS at stages, in between one test bazball has gone from a masterplan to something terrible. England took to long to suss out Cummins trap the other day, but I am sure they will learn from it. Work in progress.

Indeed , very much work in progress. And I do think they learn from mistakes : just reckon on a couple of occasions in this series they've got a bit carried away with the "full ahead" plan - and it has cost them. The game plan is fine : still requires exercising a measure of judgement. Hopefully will do so in the second innings..

[sussexpob]

Might not be the best time to have got Khawaja, because Australia have the platform now, Head coming in to push the scoring rate on might not be in our interests.

Assuming wickets don't fall, I'd imagine Australia will want to declare at tea with 450 ish on the target

[sussexpob]

Smith gone, head dropped...all happening suddenly

[Arthur Crabtree]

Been creating chances, so possible they might get a change in fortune.

[alfie]

Two can play at this short ball caper , it seems...

Couple of careless outs . But this one from Broad is just great bowling - and an even greater catch Joe Root !

Anderson will be relieved to see Head gone...

[sussexpob]

Suddenly Australia buckle. If England can get the target between 300-350, they have a chance.

[alfie]

Suddenly Australia buckle. If England can get the target between 300-350, they have a chance.

Perhaps. Bit more to do to get there though. Will need to nip these two out soonish . If Lyon can't bat that would leave the door open .

[Arthur Crabtree]

Green departs, but England need a monsoon more than wickets.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Another short ball!

[Arthur Crabtree]

Short ball gets Carey. Nice little 2-fer for Robinson.

Time for a declaration.