Pakistan v England 3rd Test, Sharjah, Nov 1-5

[Making_Splinters]

Bell has done OK this tour, 63 in the first Test and 46 in the second. Decent enough return to not merit the constant calls for him to be dropped given the for. Of the rest of the side baring Cook and Root.

Bairstow is the only comparable player who could be dropped, and given the fact he can keep wicket, you can see why Bell's name has been banded around.

Not really when you have a player in the side whose barely troubled the scorers in seven Tests. Ali needs to make a score more than Bell at this point in time.

But Ali can bowl. England won't be dropping him whilst we're still in the UAE.

Anyway, Bell will play, I'm certain of that.

Being able to bowl has nothing to do with being an opener. To be honest I think Rashid has done better this tour than Ali, personally I think we'd be a lot better investing in him. Which ever poor sod has to come in after Ali to face Steyn et al has my sympathies.

[Gingerfinch]

Bell has done OK this tour, 63 in the first Test and 46 in the second. Decent enough return to not merit the constant calls for him to be dropped given the for. Of the rest of the side baring Cook and Root.

Bairstow is the only comparable player who could be dropped, and given the fact he can keep wicket, you can see why Bell's name has been banded around.

Not really when you have a player in the side whose barely troubled the scorers in seven Tests. Ali needs to make a score more than Bell at this point in time.

But Ali can bowl. England won't be dropping him whilst we're still in the UAE.

Anyway, Bell will play, I'm certain of that.

Being able to bowl has nothing to do with being an opener. To be honest I think Rashid has done better this tour than Ali, personally I think we'd be a lot better investing in him. Which ever poor sod has to come in after Ali to face Steyn et al has my sympathies.

My point is, they won't drop him for the next test because he can bowl. They are more likely to change the batting order to accommodate him.

Ali could be dropped when we face the saffa's, depending on how well Rashid does.

[sussexpob]

South Africa have never had a decent spinner really that I can remember, its all about batting and pace bowling really in SA, you dont need a spinner .... England could arguably (from the last test side) drop Rashid and Ali for Taylor and Hales, and play Stokes further down the order in Safferland.

[sussexpob]

Whichever way they look at it though, I think England need to be prepared to write off the South Africa series if it means answering more questions about the long term capacity of this team. They cant keep on tinkering, and redrawing the boundaries of their requirements of players. Get them in, give them 5 games, if they dont perform you redraft

Mo Ali needs a series in the top 6, whether at opener, or at 6, where he is given a chance to bat properly in a top slot without the burden of leading the attack.
Bell needs another series to settle his test future once and for all
Stokes needs more time to truly answer his questions of whether or not he is good enough to bat at 6, or good enough with the ball to allow England a 4 man attack
Buttler probably needs another series to see if he can contribute
Rashid needs more time to be assessed
I would even say Wood has some questions to answer, as he has been patchy.

Questions about Bairstow were answered long ago, I cant see any conceivable reason to keep him in the team or squad.

[hopeforthebest]

The team that just played at Dubai had only 5 senior test players, Cook, Bell, Root (he's a senior now) Broad and Anderson. Moeen, Bairstow, Stokes, Buttler, Rashid and Wood are players in various stages of developement. That's not a good balance to have if you expect to win very often, especially away from home. A fair appraisal would be that they've done rather well,
If the team looks anything like this in SA I don't expect too much from that tour.

[Making_Splinters]

Whichever way they look at it though, I think England need to be prepared to write off the South Africa series if it means answering more questions about the long term capacity of this team. They cant keep on tinkering, and redrawing the boundaries of their requirements of players. Get them in, give them 5 games, if they dont perform you redraft

Mo Ali needs a series in the top 6, whether at opener, or at 6, where he is given a chance to bat properly in a top slot without the burden of leading the attack.
Bell needs another series to settle his test future once and for all
Stokes needs more time to truly answer his questions of whether or not he is good enough to bat at 6, or good enough with the ball to allow England a 4 man attack
Buttler probably needs another series to see if he can contribute
Rashid needs more time to be assessed
I would even say Wood has some questions to answer, as he has been patchy.

Questions about Bairstow were answered long ago, I cant see any conceivable reason to keep him in the team or squad.

Bairstow is doing better than Buttler, and there aren't many options outside of Billings to take that spot.

Maybe Dent if he still keeps for Gloucs, Brown at Sussex or Duckett but by that point you're in the left of left field.

Bairstow and Buttler doesn't work when you're leaving out better batsmen. Buttler needs some propper time out of Test cricket before England truly trash him.

[shankycricket]

As for Ali/Hales.

Id be tempted to drop Stokes for this test, Hales to open and Ali at 6, with South Africa in mind.

Without bowling is Ali going to open in South Africa? I doubt it, might as well give Hales a try this test, obtain Ali for his bowling, and slot Stokes back in first test in SA.

Stokes has outbowled Broad on this tour and Broad has an awful record in the subcontinent. How about dropping Broad and playing Jimmy, Wood and Stokes as your seamers?

[sussexpob]

As for Ali/Hales.

Id be tempted to drop Stokes for this test, Hales to open and Ali at 6, with South Africa in mind.

Without bowling is Ali going to open in South Africa? I doubt it, might as well give Hales a try this test, obtain Ali for his bowling, and slot Stokes back in first test in SA.

Stokes has outbowled Broad on this tour and Broad has an awful record in the subcontinent. How about dropping Broad and playing Jimmy, Wood and Stokes as your seamers?

I think Broad is certainly in the undroppable list imo, if anyone instead of Stokes, Wood would be the one of the three, but he bowled pretty well last test.

Not sure it really matters who they pick to bowl this next test, I have a feeling with 1-0 Pakistan we are going to see a 900 all out pitch

[shankycricket]

Not saying he has to be dropped as such but don't you think a horses for courses policy would be better off in places like Asia? Broad's record in Asia is abysmal. Apart from the 2012 UAE tour, he has been outbowled by every other England seamer on every other tour?

Should he be an automatic selection in Asia when others are doing better in those conditions especially when Finn is back?

[hopeforthebest]

Compared to 2012 Pakistan have a more formidable batting line up. Hafeez, Yousuf, Misbah, Shafiq and Sarfraz are difficult to remove in these conditions. England's only real hope is to win the toss and put a very big total on the board and hope scoreboard pressure gives them some aid.

[Arthur Crabtree]

The pitch in Sharjah is being predicted to be flat. Hard to imagine Pakistan'll resort to engineering a draw though. Their batting has been stronger than England's, they have the best spinner, and they've been better with an old ball. A 1-0 win will be disappointing for them (especially with a return to come in England). If they have control over it, they should welcome a result pitch. Better for the sport too.

[Slipstream]

Compared to 2012 Pakistan have a more formidable batting line up. Hafeez, Yousuf, Misbah, Shafiq and Sarfraz are difficult to remove in these conditions. England's only real hope is to win the toss and put a very big total on the board and hope scoreboard pressure gives them some aid.

I agree. Pakistan have 7 batsmen and 4 bowlers, we have Stokes, Ali, Rashid and Butter as 4 all rounders. Far too many.
5 of their batsmen are averaging over 50.00. Our all rounders are averaging 19.00, 24.33, 12.00 and 8.50. Maybe having a specialist batsman Taylor coming in for an all rounder Buttler will help and winning the toss.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Buttler isn't an all rounder, if Sarfraz is a batter, they are both either batters, or both all rounders. Stokes is in as a batter and Moeen as a bowler, though opening. England have six batters and five bowlers. They could drop Wood and play Taylor to alter the balance, or they could drop one of the players for underperforming. In this series, that means anyone apart from Root, Cook and Anderson. Unfortunately, apart from Taylor, the squad members aren't going to strengthen the side. Although arguably, having Hales ahead of your lead bowler (in the conditions) as an opener might be worthwhile. The problem (such as it is, the team is doing ok) is that some players are not playing well, not that some players perform more than one function. Last time in UAE, the team was packed with specialists, and they performed worse.

[sussexpob]

Broad's record in Asia is abysmal. Apart from the 2012 UAE tour, he has been outbowled by every other England seamer on every other tour?

Stats tell a lot of lies when taken at face value.

In 2010 in Bangladesh, those pitches were the slowest things I have ever seen. Broad only took one wicket less than Englands top seamer (6 as opposed to 7 for bresnan) on pitches were Swann and Tredwell took about 25 wickets in two games. He hardly bowled.

Sri Lanka.... debut game for one test match, the other he was basically unfit coming into the series and was rushed into a game he wasnt prepared for, then rested for the next test.

India... same story. One test before he was established in the team (he failed to perform against everyone at this time) and two tests where he hardly bowled because he was dramatically undercooked (36 overs in 4 innings).

The only real Asia tour he has been able to contribute before this series, he averaged 20 per wicket.... in the UAE. Before this tour, his record was probably up there with any seamer in the UAE.

[Making_Splinters]

Buttler isn't an all rounder, if Sarfraz is a batter, they are both either batters, or both all rounders. Stokes is in as a batter and Moeen as a bowler, though opening. England have six batters and five bowlers. They could drop Wood and play Taylor to alter the balance, or they could drop one of the players for underperforming. In this series, that means anyone apart from Root, Cook and Anderson. Unfortunately, apart from Taylor, the squad members aren't going to strengthen the side. Although arguably, having Hales ahead of your lead bowler (in the conditions) as an opener might be worthwhile. The problem (such as it is, the team is doing ok) is that some players are not playing well, not that some players perform more than one function. Last time in UAE, the team was packed with specialists, and they performed worse.

A couple of interesting questions buried in there, Arthur.

Is a wicketkeeper an all rounder? For my money, in the modern game at least, yes. You won't get even a County bearth these days if you can't bat, needless to say you won't last that long if you can't keep despite how much Akmal tried to prove otherwise. So your modern keeper has to be at least decent in two skills, surely making them all rounders? Long gone are the days when a specialist glove man could get a game.

Is Ali an all rounder? In theory at least he's England's first choice spinner, a role he does inoffensively without reaching the heights of specialist spinners all that often. He's only opening as a maridge of convenience and you can't really argue a specialist batsman would be batting at 8. The acid test is would he be playing if he couldn't bat? Short answer would be no. So he's an all rounder, or at least a bits and peices player.

I agree with, Sussex that we really need to view this series and the South Africa series as question answerers, if that is even a word.