Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Jun 20, 2017 2:32 am

Arthur Crabtree wrote:Zaman
Dharwan
Iqbal
Kohli
Williamson
Stokes
S Ahmed
Rashid
H Ali
B Kumar
M Amir

A bit unbalanced. Three openers and three number threes.


Two number threes, surely?

I'm not sure batting position makes so much difference in ODIs. A number 3 can bat at 4 or 5, and opening isn't as much of a specialisation as it is in tests. If anything, however, it's an indictment of middle-orders in every team. As we've seen, the pattern has been that teams look comfortably set at 120-150 for 2-3 at about the halfway mark, then wickets tumble.

The best performing 4/5 batsman in the tournament has arguably been Eoin Morgan:
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine ... pe=batting
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:18 am

Sorry, assumed Root was in...
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:20 am

I think of the role of 3/4 as being different from 5/6. Maybe not as much as before. 3/4 are bulkers. 5/6 are hitters.
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby rich1uk » Tue Jun 20, 2017 3:29 am

maybe not really for this disccussion but i still think the difference between root and the other guys he is grouped with, like williamson, kohli and smith, is as good as root is and as heavily as he scores, he just doesn't play enough of the sort of match winning innings the others are capable of
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:11 am

rich1uk wrote:maybe not really for this disccussion but i still think the difference between root and the other guys he is grouped with, like williamson, kohli and smith, is as good as root is and as heavily as he scores, he just doesn't play enough of the sort of match winning innings the others are capable of


I'd have to disagree with that, on the evidence. Just looking at the stats:

Root - 7 of his 10 ODI hundreds have come in wins. Averages 67 in wins. Passes 50 in more than 37% of his innings, and England win 66% of the games when he does. 7 POTM awards in 92 games (7.6%)
Smith - 7 of his 8 ODI hundreds have come in wins. Averages 56 in wins. Passes 50 in 30% of his innings, and Australia win 80% when he does. 8 POTM awards in 98 games (8.1%)
Williamson - 6 of his 9 ODI hundreds have come in wins. Averages 58 in wins. Passes 50 in 37% of his innings, and New Zealand win 55% of games when he does. 10 POTM awards in 114 games (8.7%)

Kohli's in another league IMO, but I think that those three are pretty similar in terms of ability to play matchwinning innings.
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby rich1uk » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:29 am

i hadn't looked stats, i just had an impression that the others coverted more of their 50s into 100s than root did but looking at the stats now there isn't actually much difference between them

i might have been downplaying root's contributions because of how many others have played the "flashier" innings on the back of the platforms root helps build
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:31 am

rich1uk wrote:i hadn't looked stats, i just had an impression that the others coverted more of their 50s into 100s than root did but looking at the stats now there isn't actually much difference between them

i might have been downplaying root's contributions because of how many others have played the "flashier" innings on the back of the platforms root helps build


I think it's probably a bit of that, plus also a bit of a feeling/perception that he tends to get out when set, and thus has the potential to do even better than he does (although in reality he gets out when set about as often as other top performers).
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:33 am

Frankly, I'm just happy that England has a batsman that can legitimately be considered up there with the best in the world in the ODI game. KP arguably was for the early part of his career, but other than that world class English ODI batsmen have been rare as hen's teeth for the past 25 years or so, while sides like India, South Africa and Australia constantly churn them out
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby rich1uk » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:36 am

yep and apart from the debacle against Pakistan we have the depth of batting that can play off him
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby Red Devil » Wed Jun 21, 2017 7:33 am

ddb wrote:
DCtvZC_XoAEX02D.jpg

Well done DDB :thumb

It was really good to meet up with you guys :hic

You'll have to let me know how you managed to post the pic
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby yuppie » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:47 am

Red Devil wrote:
ddb wrote:
DCtvZC_XoAEX02D.jpg

Well done DDB :thumb

It was really good to meet up with you guys :hic

You'll have to let me know how you managed to post the pic



Seems like a good day, great to put some faces to names:)
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby GarlicJam » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:57 am

come on, where is that photo?
Maybe
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby rich1uk » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:59 am

GarlicJam wrote:come on, where is that photo?


cant you see DDB's post on the previous page ?
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby shankycricket » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:28 am

ddb wrote:
DCtvZC_XoAEX02D.jpg

Man you are tall! Look even bigger on the big screen on my laptop! Quite skinny though. :rasta
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Re: Champions Trophy, KO stage, June 14-18

Postby GarlicJam » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:37 am

rich1uk wrote:
GarlicJam wrote:come on, where is that photo?


cant you see DDB's post on the previous page ?

Not on my phone, but later, on the computer, yes.

Who is who though?
Maybe
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