England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

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England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby andy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:49 pm

So the first day/night test in England is round the corner...match thread all good to go :)
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:45 pm

Weather looks reasonable.

A couple of decisions to be made by England with thirteen in the squad.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby andy » Mon Aug 14, 2017 8:11 pm

I think they will go

Cook
Stoneman
Westley
Root
Malan
Stokes
Bairstow
Moeen
Woakes
Broad
Anderson

but i hope they go

Cook
Stoneman
Westley
Root
Stokes
Bairstow
Moeen
Woakes
Broad
Anderson
Crane
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:51 pm

Got a feeling they'll leave out Woakes for another game, and Crane too. But I guess most people would like Crane to play.

Is he going to bat after Anderson?
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby andy » Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:31 am

Crane will defo play at some stage, seems pointless picking him otherwise...erm dunno where he will bat, was just rough side towards the bottom of the team lol
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:00 am

Cricinfo says Woakes is still unlikely.

The weather forecast has been so all over the place this week I don't know what to make of it. Fingers crossed for day 1, as that's when I'm going.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:25 am

Take a variety of clothing.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby alfie » Tue Aug 15, 2017 2:08 pm

Can't see them picking Crane especially for a day/ night game. Also wouldn't want to be shortening the batting in case they get caught in "difficult" conditions for batting at some stage. West Indies bowling is their stronger suit and this pink ball stuff might prove unpredictable so why take risks ?

I'm not certain Crane will feature at all , by the way. Could be just there for experience . They don't want to destroy him at the start like Kerrigan and Schofield so unless everything looks perfect for him they may not play him in the Tests. He is still very much a potential player at this stage. His selection suggests he is being considered for the Australian trip but they eat visiting spinners for breakfast down here so I'd be taking nothing for granted...
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby mikesiva » Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:02 pm

Some questions with regards to a day-night test in England....

Will dew play a part? Will it reduce the effectiveness of Bishoo?

If so, we could see the same team that played against Derbyshire, play in this Test....
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Aug 15, 2017 5:16 pm

mikesiva wrote:Some questions with regards to a day-night test in England....

Will dew play a part? Will it reduce the effectiveness of Bishoo?

If so, we could see the same team that played against Derbyshire, play in this Test....


Given the weather over the last few days, dew is very likely to play a part.

Can't see Crane having a go in a D/N test, given that the format is new to England - they'll want to play it safe. Maybe if England are 2-0 up at Lord's he'll get the last game of the summer.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Aug 16, 2017 10:24 am

The suggestion that England will adopt a seam heavy attack, just because it's a daynighter feels like another example of English reflex conservatism. Like going into a WC game in Asia with four right arm seam up bowlers. West Indies played a daynighter in Dubai, and Bishoo took 10-174. Yasir has 10 in two games. Both leggies. Lyon has done as well in daynighters as he does in morning starts.

England are in the dark. Not much is known about these games, and nothing first hand in this country. So England will revert to their default. Even though the evidence is that the ball will swing briefly when new, will swing at dusk, but go soft quickly and be hard to take wickets with otherwise. And the dark seam on the pink ball, batters say, is hard to see and so makes playing wrist spinners problematic.

The England players say that they don't know what to expect. which means they will seek the reassurance of habit. Rather like an expat eating his Sunday roast in the heat of his adopted Costa Brava home, sweating dismally into the veg.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby alfie » Wed Aug 16, 2017 10:55 am

Can't ignore that , Arthur . Though I suspect you are (a) playing devils's advocate or (b) trawling for a bite :)

It isn't a particularly "seam heavy attack" most on here are proposing ...just the normal balance that England play with anywhere except in Asia. Moeen - remember him ? Just took 25 wickets against SA - will be bowling plenty of overs . Root can bowl spin too. Are you seriously suggesting dropping one of the seamers to include Crane when the dew factor is likely to add to what I'm hearing has been a bit of damp around the ground recently ? Or do you really want to abandon the search for another middle order bat in order to fit in six bowlers ?

I know you enjoyed agitating for years for five bowlers even when they were winning with four ; but having won that one are you now embarking on your campaign to assist Bayliss in pushing for six ?

If young Crane is truly good enough , he will get his chance to prove it sooner or later. When a pitch that clearly suits his craft is served up ? Not sure it would be a great idea to throw him in to this match just for the thrill of something different.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Aug 16, 2017 10:57 am

alfie wrote:Can't ignore that , Arthur . Though I suspect you are (a) playing devils's advocate or (b) trawling for a bite :)



;)
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:09 am

Well, the obvious point to make is that Bish and Yas took their wickets in UAE, and this will be played in Birmingham. Yet we've just played three Tests on UK wickets devised to help home seamers, and the leading wicket taker was... a spinner (and a part time spinner). England have played a generation at home with two seamers often described as among their best ever, particularly in England, but just as many wickets were taken by... a spinner. A lone spinner.

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine ... pe=bowling

If England go with three plus Stokes and Mo, then I'll shrug and lament that as the UK has had fifty years to adopt metric measures and failed, why would I expect its citizens to lose their faith in right arm bowlers of seam and swing. But if they go in with five seamers, I will dash my brain out on an occasional table.
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Re: England vs West Indies First test Edgbaston

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Aug 16, 2017 11:12 am

alfie wrote:
I know you enjoyed agitating for years for five bowlers even when they were winning with four ; but having won that one are you now embarking on your campaign to assist Bayliss in pushing for six ?
.


Of course not, Mo and Gentle Ben are top order bats who add to the attack with some very good support bowling. I'm asking for a four bowler attack that they can usefully augment. Three seamers and a spinner, nothing revolutionary.
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