The Ashes: Sydney

[rich1uk]

maybe controversial but i think Australia just sneaked the days play

[meninblue]

133 runs Lead. Guess Aussie batters will come with an stroke playing intent tomorrow and try to score as many as they can in first session and then review the declaration if they do not get all out while they attack.

[sussexpob]

131 runs leaked by Mason for 1 wickets after 39 overs !!. Definitely a lot better than this is expected by specialist spinner in terms of actual statistics.

he's 20 years old, playing in his first test on a pitch where the opposition are 465-4 and cruising

i'll give him the benefit of the doubt

Ashes tests aren't creches, he's been picked as one of the 11 best cricketers England have, and should be judged thus.

1/140 is among the worst debuts in history, so he should rightfully be criticised

[rich1uk]

131 runs leaked by Mason for 1 wickets after 39 overs !!. Definitely a lot better than this is expected by specialist spinner in terms of actual statistics.

he's 20 years old, playing in his first test on a pitch where the opposition are 465-4 and cruising

i'll give him the benefit of the doubt

Ashes tests aren't creches, he's been picked as one of the 11 best cricketers England have, and should be judged thus.

1/140 is among the worst debuts in history, so he should rightfully be criticised

he's hardly done any worse than anyone else in this game so i'll judge him based on the pitch and what i saw of him, not just on what the scorecard says

[Gingerfinch]

Difficult to criticise or praise, if he had taken a fifer, after just one match, given Hirwani took 16 wickets on debut, and Warne one or two. He'll hopefully be given a bit of a run in the team, though with Ali being about to bat, that's doubtful.

[rich1uk]

Difficult to criticise or praise, if he had taken a fifer, after just one match, given Hirwani took 16 wickets on debut, and Warne one or two. He'll hopefully be given a bit of a run in the team, though with Ali being about to bat, that's doubtful.

yeah all i said originally was i'm prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt given how flat this pitch has been and he has probably looked more dangerous than any other bowler

took the edge on a number of occasions but the ball didn't go to a fielder and was a bit careless to have bowled a no-ball on a wicket

he's bowled a fair few loose deliveries but thats pretty common for a leggie

[Arthur Crabtree]

131 runs leaked by Mason for 1 wickets after 39 overs !!. Definitely a lot better than this is expected by specialist spinner in terms of actual statistics.

he's 20 years old, playing in his first test on a pitch where the opposition are 465-4 and cruising

i'll give him the benefit of the doubt

Ashes tests aren't creches, he's been picked as one of the 11 best cricketers England have, and should be judged thus.

1/140 is among the worst debuts in history, so he should rightfully be criticised

Not as good as Borthwick then (4-80ish)

[sussexpob]

What Mason crane should be doing is proving he's good enough to beat county bats, I don't see why he should have a run in the team. He's got a frankly shoddy first class record as it stands, and has just produced some incredibly poor figures.

Is it a surprise?

[Dr Cricket]

that the reason why at the moment country cricket pitches are poor.
the bowlers that do well are not the bowlers you want to play international cricket.
pretty sure the list of bowlers England actually like in terms of pace or Spin don't play county cricket or have a bad record at first class level.
so the players that actually got raw pace or some talent with spin can't learn more because they don't play games for their counties and top of that when england pick them for lions or england set up they probably don't do well either because they haven't played much in first class cricket.

[Dr Cricket]

what mason crane will be hoping is that he isn't the next Ravi patel or Adam riley in that they were the next big thing for england spinners and then next county season some other spinner takes the title.

personally I hope they give crane a good go in the side now for picking him.

[alfie]

Anyone who has actually watched the game today will recognize that Crane's figures are far from an accurate reflection of the way he bowled.
Of course he bowled a few loose balls - what 20 year old debutant wrist spinner doesn't ? But he also bowled a lot of very testing deliveries ; dismissed one very well set batsman and might with an ounce of luck had two or three more...

Plenty of good judges who are fairly well equipped to assess his type of bowler - notably including a certain S Warne - like what they see. Obviously he is far from the finished article - that losing the run up thing needs to be ironed out , for one - but he has shown enough today for me to say he needs to be given whatever opportunities he can , within the limits of the England team's programme , to develop into their regular spin bowler if he can continue to learn. And I never expected to say that about a leg spinner.

It might not be easy. Conditions won't always suit . Team balance will be an issue. And he may not develop as hoped. But if they don't at least try to utilize his obvious talent then they have wasted their time bringing him on this tour...

[meninblue]

Anyone who has actually watched the game today will recognize that Crane's figures are far from an accurate reflection of the way he bowled.
Of course he bowled a few loose balls - what 20 year old debutant wrist spinner doesn't ? But he also bowled a lot of very testing deliveries ; dismissed one very well set batsman and might with an ounce of luck had two or three more...

Plenty of good judges who are fairly well equipped to assess his type of bowler - notably including a certain S Warne - like what they see. Obviously he is far from the finished article - that losing the run up thing needs to be ironed out , for one - but he has shown enough today for me to say he needs to be given whatever opportunities he can , within the limits of the England team's programme , to develop into their regular spin bowler if he can continue to learn. And I never expected to say that about a leg spinner.

It might not be easy. Conditions won't always suit . Team balance will be an issue. And he may not develop as hoped. But if they don't at least try to utilize his obvious talent then they have wasted their time bringing him on this tour...

Mason may win many many matches for England in future. But he has flopped tremendously in this match. 139/1 in 39 odd overs is not what s specialist spinners performance is expected, at least at Sydney. Also he was bowling on day 2 and day 3 rather than day 1 or 2 to ignore such a performance. If Aussies have to bat again in 2nd innings, then he definitely has to pick wickets.

[Dr Cricket]

I actually like Crane but isn't it crazy that he has to learn how to bowl spin in a test match and not actually learn this in County cricket.

[alfie]

I actually like Crane but isn't it crazy that he has to learn how to bowl spin in a test match and not actually learn this in County cricket.

Well yes. But unless you can change the English climate quicker than waiting for Global Warming to do the job , you'd have to persuade the money men to get the CC back into the right part of the summer instead of giving way to the fast food of the limited over stuff...

They've made changes designed to help the spinner ...the four day game instead of three ; and recently this change to the traditional toss at the start. But it really isn't quite as simple as we might wish. There are reasons why certain types of player tend to develop in some countries more than others ; and overcoming them is not something that can be easily addressed by artificial tinkering with the rules .
I would love to see some young English spinners given a chance in , say , Australian state teams ...but they tend to be a bit less welcoming than English counties with their Kolpaks and descendants of British parents...

[Dr Cricket]

TBH it was more that counties don't pick spinners, raw pace etc and that smaller counties don't produce dry decks anymore.
Northant in particular was always spin friendly before.
how can dawnson be the number 1 spinner for hampshire.

Really the pitches should be more similar to the test pitches around the world.

Anyway like I said last week it is upto ECB if they want to fix it or if they are happy to only win at home.
That will be Root biggest challenge in persuading ECB to get Spinners and fast bowlers through the system.