First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

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Re: First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

Postby Adi » Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:53 am

Alviro Patterson wrote:
Adi wrote:
The second point you made about not enough chance to bat long : Last year similar voices were raised by Pakistani domestic players. Many pak international current and ex players also felt they do not have long term batsman for 400 ball innings is that the Quaid -E-Azam (will refer to QEA henceforth because its long). There the groundsmen get only 2 days to prepare a wicket. But naturally wickets were falling very easily last year in QEA. Batsmen started raising voices. The Pak management said they had to cram the domestic trophy for various reasons. Actually the current Pak administrator are the best which they had in previous tenures. Najam Sethi is much better than Taquir Zia, nasim Ashraf, Shahryar Khan , Ijaz Butt and Zaka Ashraf.

But say if Pak and England domestic format have roads will it start to produce Cook, Amla, Clarke, Rahul, Sachin, Chet, Virat etc. How will they fare on other wickets then which help even little bit of swing. Will they then start producing bad bowlers because bowlers will not get help. So how true is the thought that lack of flat wickets is not helping to develop marathon innings batsmen. I wonder.


9 of the 14 County Championship matches are going to be played in April/Early May and September. Pitches in April are greener and softer, whilst the weather is unsettled making it difficult for top 4 batsmen to build an innings of any sort as the ball zips round. Pitches in September are more slow and worn, but no bad thing with the upcoming tour of Sri Lanka.

There are only 3 County Championship matches in July and August where the weather is at it's finest. Batsmen need a block of matches where they know they can bat at length, also pace bowlers need to be tested for their endurance in bowling 20 over days under summer weather rather than take cheap early season 5-fers.


Cook also played in the same county system.

Has the county system conditions changed after it produced batters like Cook, KP, Bell, Trott.
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Re: First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

Postby sussexpob » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:55 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:9 of the 14 County Championship matches are going to be played in April/Early May and September. Pitches in April are greener and softer, whilst the weather is unsettled making it difficult for top 4 batsmen to build an innings of any sort as the ball zips round. Pitches in September are more slow and worn, but no bad thing with the upcoming tour of Sri Lanka.

There are only 3 County Championship matches in July and August where the weather is at it's finest. Batsmen need a block of matches where they know they can bat at length, also pace bowlers need to be tested for their endurance in bowling 20 over days under summer weather rather than take cheap early season 5-fers.



Again, this seems like a bit of a strange reason to pin point. If pitches are helping bowlers too much, then you'd have to imagine that bowlers being thrown into the national side are actually worse than billed, but batsman would be used to tough challenges of batting in hard conditions, and that would make their transition to tests more seamless.

I fail to see how a batsman averaging very well on bowler friendly pitches is in anyway misrepresenting his ability to step up. If so, then why do you believe so? Common sense would dictate the effect would be the very opposite. Players who make good scores regularly on tough pitches should surely then go onto flat decks and bat all day.... yet England cant even make 300 on roads.
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Re: First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

Postby sussexpob » Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:44 pm

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Re: First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

Postby Alviro Patterson » Sat Mar 31, 2018 10:24 am

Adi wrote:
Cook also played in the same county system.

Has the county system conditions changed after it produced batters like Cook, KP, Bell, Trott.


The County Cricket programme has changed significantly since Cook made his test debut back in 2005. For example the 50 over competition was played in two formats, then scrapped before reinstated in 2014. 40 over cricket was a feature in the domestic calendar from 2006-2013. Twenty20 was played in two different formats between 2006 and 2013, before settling on the Blast in 2014.

One Day cricket used to be played the day after a Championship fixture, but group stages are now played in blocks since 2014. The Blast used to be played on a Friday nights in between Championship matches from May, but now has a block between July and August. Because white ball competitions are now played in blocks, it has shunted County Championship matches mainly in spring and autumn.
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Re: First Test: New Zealand v England. 22-26 March.

Postby Alviro Patterson » Mon Apr 02, 2018 7:53 am

sussexpob wrote:
Again, this seems like a bit of a strange reason to pin point. If pitches are helping bowlers too much, then you'd have to imagine that bowlers being thrown into the national side are actually worse than billed, but batsman would be used to tough challenges of batting in hard conditions, and that would make their transition to tests more seamless.

I fail to see how a batsman averaging very well on bowler friendly pitches is in anyway misrepresenting his ability to step up. If so, then why do you believe so? Common sense would dictate the effect would be the very opposite. Players who make good scores regularly on tough pitches should surely then go onto flat decks and bat all day.... yet England cant even make 300 on roads.


Batting on flat decks is one thing, but doing it in venue temperatures of 30C+ and under direct sunlight for hours is a real test of endurance. County batsmen (and bowlers) rarely play matches in these conditions, which are more frequent in cricket overseas.

For example, the Ben Stokes 2nd innings dismissal in the Auckland test was inexplicable from a technical aspect because his approach was excellent prior to getting suckered in by Wagner. The only thing I can of why Stokes wafted his bat at an unreachable delivery is because he may have suffered from sunstroke.
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