Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby bigfluffylemon » Sat Oct 20, 2018 3:48 am

sussexpob wrote:You don't think they've paid enough of a price?


They have been out for six months or so, but in that time Australia have played all of three test matches (one right after the incident), and five ODIs.

Stokes missed more games than that and was cleared of all charges (whatever your views on that incident are).

So no, I don't think they've paid enough of a price.

Also, I have to agree with GJ and alfie - this was a big deal here in Australia. A lot of Australians already didn't like their team very much. Maybe a lesser ban would have been reasonable and have been accepted, but having imposed it, to withdraw the moment the team starts losing would remove what little goodwill CA has left. It would be seen for the cynical move it is. I can't see it happening.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Thu Oct 25, 2018 8:20 am

It feels wrong getting bowled out in a T20 innings.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby andy » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:09 am

Pathetic batting display, with Nathan Coulter-Nile top scoring!!!
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby andy » Sun Oct 28, 2018 5:58 pm

Pak 121-2 after 16 in 3rd t20

Babar made 50

Lyon and Tye wicket a piece so far
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby bigfluffylemon » Sun Oct 28, 2018 10:07 pm

Yet another pathetic batting performance from Australia. From 60-2 after 7 overs to 117 all out.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby GarlicJam » Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:16 pm

sussexpob wrote:Wouldn't be surprised to see a few bans lifted before India arrive

Back to this.

Every few days since I read this, I see/hear someone in Aus agitating for the cutting/lessening of the bans. Every article/rant on tellie probably brings this closer to eventuality.

However, surely if CA do cut the bans and allow them to return earlier than expected, surely this will just reinforce the finding of the review that CA shows a 'win at all costs mentality'...?
Maybe




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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby yuppie » Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:53 pm

It can't be allowed to happen.

On a personal note, it would kill supporting Australia for me, its been hard enough getting back into it after all that's happened.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:31 am

Agreed.

The ACA is arguing that the players should be allowed back. I can't see the public accepting it. I wouldn't. I'm just organising tickets to the Sri-Lanka test match in February - this is making me think twice. I'm not going if Smith and Warner are playing.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby sussexpob » Tue Oct 30, 2018 9:28 am

sussexpob wrote: I always had a personal suspicion that the cricket players association would force the issue of the lengthy bans with the National Board. They promised an investigation into the bans, saying that they had no justification. I just wonder maybe if that narrative could suddenly reappear in the next few weeks, that the bans were unjust, and suddenly, magically lifted.


Et voila!

It occurs to me that this is all a bit of a plan, as highlighted a few weeks ago. The ACA spoke out passionately about the lack of legal justifications of the bans and that they would fight them, then suddenly retreated into the bunker claiming they needed time (you need 7 months to check this out??? seriously???) . If they really thought the bans were unjustified from that perspective, then surely they as a players union had the responsibility to make issue of it there and then, and legally fight the bans as soon as they were issued, or at least put in motion straightaway the legal mechanics to fight it? It all seems its a bit of a rouse, that the ACA were delaying any full bloodied assault for another day.

Now, as predicted, they have come back. The timing is very convienent. I'd have to guess there is a lot of collusion going on here. The players association agreeing to not action anything until some ban had been served, the CA making it look like their hands are tied will lift the bans, and everyone walks away happy that justice is served.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby yuppie » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:09 pm

No one has said they are coming back yet though. This is just a union representing their players and trying to do the best by them.

Seriously if they have the ban lifted then im going have to find another sport to follow.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby sussexpob » Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:02 pm

What justification does anyone have for Smith and Co serving that long a ban? Dinesh Chandimal just got a one game ban recently for the same thing. Afridi got two T20s for trying to eat the ball. Faf, Athers and everyone else got off with no ban. The most days of cricket ever missed was 5..... these Aussies got 73 times longer bans than the current longest ever given. Cricket Boards are not courts, they have to find fair and rational punishments with reference to due course, when they are making decisions. The ACA should quite rightly be attacking these ridiculous bans.

What purpose does a long ban serve? These guys have not exactly had it easy, quite the opposite. Smith's press conference alone was enough of a punishment in my eyes, it was a total humiliation. He'd have escaped the room looking better if he had turned up, dropped his trousers, put his pants on his head and started dancing around singing.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby sussexpob » Tue Oct 30, 2018 1:16 pm

The fact is, I cant help but feel that Smith isnt being punished for what he did on the field, but he's being punished for uncovering a crisis of conscious in Aussie national identity. When people look at cricket culture, no doubt they want to find parallel in the traditional notion that the game is played fair, honestly, hard, and in a great spirit, and that these values also are endemic in those that come to represent Australia, and are central to mainstream social culture also. When cricket turned out to be rotten to the core, it gets people looking at themselves and thinking more about what it says about them, about society in general. So the reaction has been fierce. Australian's want Smith to pay more for the crimes of others, because they want to show they are morally superior to the rest of the world, turn this into a show of oneupmanship.

Ironically, in trying to show that fairness is a national quality, they have hung out three guys and blasted them with irrational and authoritative punishment. Nothing says "fair" like heat of the moment "let them pay" nonsense. What is fair is that they are treated equally in the eyes of justice, and that the mechanics of justice is proportional to past precedent. None of this happened; celebrating their continued punishment seems like validating a lot of horrible things. Its like a sporting equivalent of celebrating the death penalty, or agreeing with Guantanamo Bay.You cant dispatch with the notions of justice just because you think a certain scapegoat has come along to pummel. There are no exceptions to justice.

Also, is there a great deal of parallel between the team culture and the fans? I am being simultaneous told Smith committed a major crime against the sport, and that this CA win win win culture was evil and absurd, not something compatible with Aussie culture...... then a week ago an Australia keeper ran out a Pakistan batsman who didnt even know the ball was in play, and all the responses form Aussie's here was largely "win win win"..... nothing about the spirit of the game, nothing like that. Is the team culture sh*t because the fans demand it, or the other way round? Chicken or the egg? How caon one judge Smith's morals with such brutality, but then a week later not even acknowledge that spirit of the game exists? Strange ay..... Im not getting at Aussie's by the way. I spend 90% of words on this board in relation to cricket, tearing into the culture of the ECB and English cricket.

Where was the outrage when the last captain threatened physical violence on a tailender? Where was the outrage when one of your players mocked someone with a mental illness? The team culture has been a disgrace for years, its nothing new. The game is no longer a place of gentlemanly conduct, honesty and fair play..... every team plays to win, why uphold the game to some unrealistic standard and view it like its a "Worthers Original" advert environment? I wouldnt be happy as Smith, he's essentially been held account to a higher standard than has existed for decades.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby yuppie » Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:48 pm

I think everyone has different views on what is acceptable and what they see as crossing the line. I think all Australian supporters here have viewed their thoughts on this situation, and all seem to be in agreement on what they find as suitable punishment for what occurred.

This is a place of debate, but sometimes it feels like the their is no debate, and merely a lecture in how your views are wrong. It certainly seems Australian supporters hold their team to different standards then other supporters hold their own teams to. What one person thinks is acceptable, others do not. I really find this place hard sometimes when it can feel like you are just getting lectured at all the time.

As a contributor on a few different chat rooms, this site can be the hardest to have a differing view on and almost impossible to have sensible discussion on. Time for a break.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:32 pm

The big advantage of discussing sport over theology is that eventually you will find out who is right.
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Re: Pakistan v Australia in the UAE: Test Series

Postby sussexpob » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:56 pm

Yuppie,

Your generic criticism hardly masks the aim of your barb. If you have a problem with my posts and want to discuss it, then PM me
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