India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:41 am

BBC calling it a thrilling counter attack!
I always say that everybody's right.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 11:42 am

Arthur Crabtree wrote:BBC calling it a thrilling counter attack!


They played their shots, but on another day both could have been out after 2-3 overs.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:09 pm

alfie wrote:But the concern is the apparent failure of the England brains trust to learn from experience : that short attack on the tail has failed too often so why not give it a rest and ask world class bowlers to attack the stumps of tail enders ? Has some analyst produced data to show Shami and Bumrah get out to short balls for small scores rather often ? Perhaps (I have neither the time nor the inclination to investigate) but if so have the circumstances surrounding those dismissals (score , partner , pace/arm of bowler , pitch conditions ) all been taken into account ? Have to doubt it : memory of just one year ago between the same teams should surely have over ridden it anyway , no ?


The last half of India's batting line up bucks all kinds of historical trends, because they hardly ever get out at the wicket. Bumrah has the lowest amount of bowled dismissals in test history for someone who has played as many innings, Shami is 4th in the lowest lbw rate (with Bumrah not far behind) .... Pant (7th), Shami (4th) and Bumrah (2nd) all time for dismissals coming in the form of caught by someone other than the keeper. The natural conclusion when someone has such a high proportion of outfield catches, and hardly any caught behinds/bowled/lbws is the player in question must be playing their shots, and that they are decent in blocking.

But analysis of Shami/Bumrah dismissals shows neither gets out playing positive. Bumrah has two dismissals in the deep to Nathan Lyon, but other than that he is almost always out edging into the cordon playing length/off stump lines. Shami is the same. In all their dismissals, only Bumrah got out to a short ball once.... the bowler was Stuart Broad, who injured him with a bouncer that hit his glove. But hardly an endorsement of England's tactics to bowl short to him, because he averaged 3 runs an innings at that time, and under the barrage of short balls the world's worst averaging batsman managed to see out 70 minutes of aimless short bowling while his full time batsman at the other end wracked up a century. It was also Bumrah's highest test innings.

Jadeja apparently faced Leach the most in his innings..... left arm spin accounts for his highest dismissal average in tests, so England pretty much used the option he has been historically most comfortable with. I seen a stat too about Pant and his relative success based on length. There was, and still is, a widely held belief that he cant play the short ball, but his average/SR to short bowling proves its his strength. Despite his unorthodox style and ability to hit anything, orthodox stump to stump, good length bowling both stops him scoring more, and reduces all his performance metrics. Yet England banged it into him, and his SR to those lengths is about 7 an over in test cricket. No wonder he dug into the buffet.

The worst though was Jadeja. The analytics on his innings show that when England's right arm pace bowlers pitched it at lengths, they produced false shots. The "expected wickets" on these lengths was 3.8 for the innings. Short/spin produced a negative expected wicket rating. Yet he got an innings of spin and short pitched bowling.

All in all, the answer is no. England's bang it short tactic was dumb.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:31 pm

Bairstow continues to bat like he's found a magic lamp, and used all three wishes on good fortune.

The English press are raving about another classic, but he spent all of yesterday and about 30-45 minutes today looking like a walking wicket. And just before rains comes he flips one shot a cm away from a fielder (for the third time), before overturning an lbw dismissal on a thin inside edge.

Someone needs to publish his lottery numbers
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Durhamfootman » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:51 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:BBC calling it a thrilling counter attack!

on message?
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:53 pm

Yes. Client journalism.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Durhamfootman » Sun Jul 03, 2022 12:54 pm

Only 18 overs bowled before lunch, so I'm guessing that the rain is still messing everything up
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:14 pm

Yeah it rained... Bairstow finally finds a fielder, 240/7... England 175 behind. Billings can whack them.

I guess this formula for Bairstow has worked.. may as well whack a few and ride his luck, and hope it pays off. 5 centuries this year is a way to prove whatever I say wrong, after all...
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:26 pm

Maybe England assumed Indian batsman play bouncers like Stuart Broad....

I mean, I dont even know how to describe that dismissal....
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 2:39 pm

Billings is castled... lead 149. England, saving Anderson mimicking Bumrah, are going to be miles behind
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Durhamfootman » Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:00 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:BBC calling it a thrilling counter attack!

yet they still let 20 overs of the flat soft ball go begging.

time for the short ball cunning plan again?
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:09 pm

Who knows how many England can chase though.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:16 pm

sussexpob wrote:saving Anderson mimicking Bumrah, are going to be miles behind


Well, there's the first with Anderson's third ball!

Gill c Crawley b Anderson for second time in the game.
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby sussexpob » Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:19 pm

Gill is annoyingly flakey. Such a lovely stroke maker when he's in, but he's got to improve if he wants to stick around
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Re: India in England Aug-Sep 2021 (& July 2022)

Postby alfie » Sun Jul 03, 2022 5:44 pm

sussexpob wrote:Bairstow continues to bat like he's found a magic lamp, and used all three wishes on good fortune.

The English press are raving about another classic, but he spent all of yesterday and about 30-45 minutes today looking like a walking wicket. And just before rains comes he flips one shot a cm away from a fielder (for the third time), before overturning an lbw dismissal on a thin inside edge.

Someone needs to publish his lottery numbers



Can't have that , Sussex. Struggled to survive against some excellent bowling : but survive he did. Then he slaughtered the bowling for a chanceless hundred. Did he play a couple of shots not totally in control ? Does any batsman not in a serious innings ?

Seriously I think you are letting your stubborn refusal to accept that the fellow can play interfere with your judgement.

But opinions are free for all of us ...I think yours is going to be a minority one this week.
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