England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

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England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby andy » Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:14 pm

Over the course of a few different posts here, i shall be looking at the transitional stage now for england in many different positions...

Part 1: Batting

The top 7 in australia failed and failed badly, and have done so for a while now..There are only 4 players i expect to line up in 2015 against the aussies:

Cook,Bell,Root,Stokes

Carberry - A talented batsman, maybe 2 years too late this trip for him. Hasn't looked the usual free-flowing batsman he is for Hampshire, and has been found out with bowlers going round the wicket to him and cramping him for room. However at least he stood up and played Johnson's short ball better than some of his counter parts : Verdict: Will see him around the one day sides but maybe no more test cricket for him

Trott: Very tough to say. However it's difficult to see him returning to the side and if he does it may not be for long, England's best no3 for a long time and sadly we may have seen the last of him

KP: I can't see him playing another test match. He and Flower contiously seem to be at loggerheads and it's clear that's about his invovlcement in IPL. He hasn't been the same since he lost the captaincy which is a real shame for England. I can see him going off to the IPL.

Prior/Bairstow: Prior at the age of 31 has plenty of time on his side and is a magnificent keeper-batsman, but he has been out of nick for well over 12 months, which isn't just a blip, and could be a terminal decline in his batting, needs early runs for Sussex to have any chance of playing against sri lanka in the summer. Bairstow, simply isnt' good enough. Has multiple flaws in his technique, struggles against short, fast pitched bowling, and also struggles with the ball pitched up and on the stumps, and is a walking wicket.


The contenders

Nick Compton: Compton could well be in for a suprise re-call with his replacements struggling. Obviously his early test record is poor, averaging a mere 31 from 9 tests. However he did make back to back centuries against a decent NZ attack. He does much more than the numbers suggest though, he blunts the bowling, takes the shine off the new ball and allows the middle order to come in against an older ball and acclerate the scoring..Compton back could work now that Trott isn't at 3 and the top 3 won't be all doing this role....

James Taylor- Taylor, perhaps one of the most unluckiest batsman in england. His talent and class are unquestionable. He needed to move to a div 1 side to prove his worth after scoring runs for fun in div 2 which he did. He moved to a tricky trent bridge wicket, struggled in his 1st season, but was back to his best last season. He struggled in his 2 tests against SA but impressed with his composure and temparement and is clearly a fantastic batsman. He has a very good f/c record, scoring nearly 6500 runs at an average of 47 with 16 centuries, and surely time for him to get a re-call.

San Robson- Another suprise contender, an opening batsman who has burst on the scene over the past 2-3 seasons. Our aussie friends will know a lot about him as well. Having comitted himself to england he will surely be looking for a call-up to the full side having impressed over the winter in OZ. He has a modest f/c record just averaging 39, however his composure if something which impresses the selectors and he dosen't get flustered under pressure.

Jos Buttler - Someone who i hope will take the gloves against sri lanka in the summer. This guy has the potential to be the Adam Gilchrist for england at no7. He has shots all round the ground and reign himself in for the longer form of the game. Is a fantastic keeper and the only reason he didn't keep for somerset was because he was better than Kieswetter in the outfield as well, which he has proved time and time again. He has moved to lancashire in search of regualr glovework in the longer form of the game and will certainly get it now


Joe Root - needs a settled spot in the england side and needs a long run there...his off spin will also prove vital esepcially if KP does go off into the IPL sunset..


my top 7 for the sri lanka series

Cook
Root
Bell
Taylor
Ballance
Stokes
Buttler (wk)
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Wed Jan 08, 2014 12:25 am

KP has committed his future to England, so his future is down to Flower.

Compton won't feature again under Flower.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Wed Jan 08, 2014 1:41 am

cricketfan90 wrote:

my top 7 for the sri lanka series

Cook
Root
Bell
Taylor
Ballance
Stokes
Buttler (wk)


Quite like that top 7 for the medium term, although Buttler hasn't shown his First Class credentials just yet hence his move to Lancashire. Could do with another experienced campaigner in that line up so i'm thinking Matt Prior to make a comeback.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby SaintPowelly » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:07 am

Personally, I would forget entirerely about central contracts, forget entirely about previous accomplishments and send EVERONE back to County cricket for the first few weeks of the season and the best 12 or 13 English qualified players should be called up for the 1st Sri Lanka ( ?? ) test, if that means XI debutants then so be it, start entirely from scratch.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:14 pm

SaintPowelly wrote:Personally, I would forget entirerely about central contracts, forget entirely about previous accomplishments and send EVERONE back to County cricket for the first few weeks of the season and the best 12 or 13 English qualified players should be called up for the 1st Sri Lanka ( ?? ) test, if that means XI debutants then so be it, start entirely from scratch.


A prolonged spell of County Cricket is what most Central Contract players need. I'd go as far as giving Eoin Morgan the ODI captaincy against Sri Lanka so Alastair Cook can rediscover his test form with 7 County Championship matches and a University Warm Up game.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Gingerfinch » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:16 pm

11 debutants. Most of our better county players have proved they are not good enough, so what will the rest do?
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:26 pm

Dr Robert wrote:11 debutants. Most of our better county players have proved they are not good enough, so what will the rest do?


and most senior England players aren't exactly justifying their places in the team with their inadequate performances.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Gingerfinch » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:28 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:
Dr Robert wrote:11 debutants. Most of our better county players have proved they are not good enough, so what will the rest do?


and most senior England players aren't exactly justifying their places in the team with their inadequate performances.


Not lately, but players like Cook, Broad, Bell, and KP have been there and done it. You can't drop all of them. if they continue to fail, then have another look.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:53 pm

Dr Robert wrote:
Alviro Patterson wrote:
Dr Robert wrote:11 debutants. Most of our better county players have proved they are not good enough, so what will the rest do?


and most senior England players aren't exactly justifying their places in the team with their inadequate performances.


Not lately, but players like Cook, Broad, Bell, and KP have been there and done it. You can't drop all of them. if they continue to fail, then have another look.


Wholesale changes didn't do Australia much harm and they have managed to regain The Ashes in devastating fashion. Senior players can't be taking their places for granted and there are talented prospects on the County Cricket waiting in the wings who have consistently performed year in year out.

It would be unlikely for 11 debutants to make their England debuts if the ECB adopted Powelly's approach, the one-time England players like Graham Onions, Ravi Bopara, Steve Davies and James Taylor are likely to resurface.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Gingerfinch » Wed Jan 08, 2014 4:56 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:
Dr Robert wrote:
Alviro Patterson wrote:
Dr Robert wrote:11 debutants. Most of our better county players have proved they are not good enough, so what will the rest do?


and most senior England players aren't exactly justifying their places in the team with their inadequate performances.


Not lately, but players like Cook, Broad, Bell, and KP have been there and done it. You can't drop all of them. if they continue to fail, then have another look.


Wholesale changes didn't do Australia much harm and they have managed to regain The Ashes in devastating fashion. Senior players can't be taking their places for granted and there are talented prospects on the County Cricket waiting in the wings who have consistently performed year in year out.

It would be unlikely for 11 debutants to make their England debuts if the ECB adopted Powelly's approach, the one-time England players like Graham Onions, Steve Davies and James Taylor are likely to resurface.


A couple of tweaks, like they did after Perth is fine. Prior now knows he has to score a few for Sussex for example. I'm a bit 'form is temporary, class is permanent' so always believe a player will come back, unless they're getting on or have incurred a bad injury.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Alviro Patterson » Wed Jan 08, 2014 5:16 pm

Worked for Ian Bell when he got dropped in 2010 and Tim Bresnan always finds himself back in the England squad whenever he gets dropped. Central Contract players should spend more time with their counties rather than this resting and training lark.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby GG - Amir Sohail » Wed Jan 08, 2014 6:33 pm

What about something like:

Root
Cook
Bell
KP
Taylor/Ballance
Moeen
Stokes
A wk who can actually keep (?)

then 3 of Bresnan, Anderson, Broad and Onions. Would probably have to bring Monty back for Asian/turning pitches though.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Durhamfootman » Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:20 pm

Alviro Patterson wrote:
Wholesale changes didn't do Australia much harm and they have managed to regain The Ashes in devastating fashion. Senior players can't be taking their places for granted and there are talented prospects on the County Cricket waiting in the wings who have consistently performed year in year out.

wholesale changes from when? from 3 years ago? I reckon Clarke, Watson, Haddin, Siddle, Johnson, Harris, Smith are still around. That's 7 of the current side. hardly wholesale changes

And Aus went through some terrible times, with terrible results, and a coach or two, over the 3 year period. I wonder how many supporters, journo's, pundits in England would tolerate that?

There'd be a riot, I reckon

I remember England winning practically *modded* all for 26 years. Not too keen on going through that again any time soon.
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby Durhamfootman » Wed Jan 08, 2014 9:21 pm

Taylor is too small.

He'll never make it

happy to eat humble pie later, but don't think I will ever have to
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Re: England - re-building for the future (PART 1)

Postby DiligentDefence » Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:12 pm

Durhamfootman wrote:Taylor is too small.

He'll never make it

happy to eat humble pie later, but don't think I will ever have to

LIke Tendulkar, Gavaskar, Kallicharran, who are all shorter.
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