Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

What's buzzing in the world of cricket....

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby m@tt » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:04 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:Well, many feel that the sacking was purely the work of Flower. Downton had been in the job for five minutes, and had been out of the game, and can't have had time to develop a personal agenda. Cook comes across as quite a submissive figure, rather than the man of steel that Moores suggests. Some feel that KP was sacked to deflect attention away from the role of the captain and the coach in a 5-0 defeat. It was KP who was poisoning the well, and once he went, all would be fine again. These are possibilities, but we don't know. Personally I think that while many have contributed to the problem, the major culpability lay with Flower's management methods, and the best way forward would have been to have sacked him (and Cook who is a poor captain).

We all have opinions on KP despite not playing for England or ever meeting him. I'm sure Downton had his own opinions prior to getting the job.
Andy Flower wrote:This is going to test my coaching expertise. This is the worst case I've ever seen.
User avatar
m@tt
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:20 pm
Team(s) Supported: .
England and Warwickshire.

Also tend to follow any former/current/prospective England players.

606 Username: matt_h88

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby m@tt » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:04 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:And it's not KP against everyone else. So far Tremlett has backed him. Clearly no one out of the present team will back him, but KP does say that he has had messages of support.

We've been over and over why he didn't play for Surrey last season.

In terms of pissing into the wind, I reckon at least half the posters on this thread are antagonistic to KP.

Difficult to tell
Matt

Haven't really had time to get my thoughts down. I usually post more regularly on the Telegraph but there's so many articles and so many voices that it's difficult to get into conversation.

I find myself agreeing with a lot of the journalists outside the print industry - Cricinfo and a lot of the blogs run by a group of minor journalists I follow on Twitter (Peter Miller, Dave Tickers, legsidelizzy, Demitri Old etc). You can't ignore what KP has said, the "revelations" can't just be brushed under the carpet. The book is of course the world according to KP, so rather large pinches of salt are needed. But some of the things he says do ring true, if with some exaggeration. That said, he goes overboard on Flower and Prior, whilst other incidents seem to have been deliberately glossed over or "forgotten".

KP is and always has been a bit of a *modded*. Even with good intentions, he can make a real ham-fisted attempt at things (Moores, Notts, Hampshire etc). I've said this a number of times over the years, despite being a big supporter of him. A character flaw that is quite apparent to me is a tendency to hold grudges - he never forgave the ECB for the captaincy being taken from him. For example, the ODI/T20 retirement was him trying to call their bluff, make them give in to him. It didn't work and he looked rather silly. Textgate could have been sorted much earlier had he been honest and straightforward with them. He didn't want to be seen as giving in to them. He got dropped.

But I do think there is something rotten at the ECB. It is sad and pathetic that they have been leaking anti-KP material to the press - even more so because a lot of that material has been petty. They've got some cronies in the print media who are writing exactly what they want them to say, but it has come across very poorly. Some of the articles written by Newman especially have been full of vitriol and are as one-eyed as KP's book (though we should expect nothing else from Henderson who is a sad and bitter old man).

And I've been very unimpressed with some things the ECB has said this year. We've been told that "people outside cricket" aren't allowed to disagree with them, that we are "stakeholders", that we should just "move on" and that Cook comes from the "right sort of family" to be England captain. In one sense these are minor PR gaffs, but they do give a window into the thinking of that organisation. The printed media had surprisingly little to say about these things.

KP was never going to beat them. And as they each hated the other, even agreement was out of the question.

So my position is one of sympathy to KP. He has been treated poorly - both before and after the sacking. He is right that changes are needed with the England set-up and upper management. I hope that Moores and Cook take his thoughts on board, even if they don't publicly say so. But it is all a bit over the top and the grudges are too noticeable. I have a lot of respect, individually and collectively, for what the England team achieved. It is sad that he can't be more balanced with his criticism, but again I think he should not be ignored. But ultimately what's saddest is that due to a big collection of screw-ups, agendas and arse-kissing, we will never see a brilliant batsman play for England again.
Andy Flower wrote:This is going to test my coaching expertise. This is the worst case I've ever seen.
User avatar
m@tt
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:20 pm
Team(s) Supported: .
England and Warwickshire.

Also tend to follow any former/current/prospective England players.

606 Username: matt_h88

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Aidan11 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:05 pm

Dr Robert wrote:
Arthur Crabtree wrote:KP is in the Radio Times!

There might be aliens who have had enough of reading about him.


Blimey............the radio times is still about?


I'm amazed radio is still about.
2010 Ind v Oz fantasy league
2011-12 internal Prem footy prediction league
2012 US Open Golf Prediction league
2012 Eng vs WI ODIs fantasy league
2012 TV Cup Winner
2012 CC Final Placings Prediction league
2014 Eng v India Test FL
2014 Royal London One Day Cup FL
2014 Ryder Cup FL
2015 Ashes Test FL
2015 County Championship Division 1 FL
2016 SA v Eng Test FL
2016 Eng v SL Test FL
2016 Eng v SL ODI FL
2022 County Championship Div 2 FL
2023 County Championship Div 2 FL
User avatar
Aidan11
 
Posts: 48590
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Team(s) Supported: Durham CCC, Hartlepool United

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby m@tt » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:07 pm


Speaking of hypocrites...

KP is honest. That’s one of the reasons why I like him. It is perfectly acceptable to say he is missing his wife after being without her since January 21 and it is perfectly acceptable to bemoan the length of tours.

This may be a very enviable glamorous lifestyle, and I include myself in that, but I think anyone would find it hard to be away from their loved ones for months on end, however nice the place they are in and however privileged they are to be part of the England set-up.

In our article Kevin makes plenty of positive comments too and they are all accurately reported, nothing is taken out of context.

I still maintain he was hard done by by England and I’m glad he is prepared to say what he feels. It is much better than hiding behind a plethora of platitudes and saying nothing that will command attention.


http://newmanblog.dailymail.co.uk/2009/ ... rview.html

With thanks to Dmitri Old.
Andy Flower wrote:This is going to test my coaching expertise. This is the worst case I've ever seen.
User avatar
m@tt
 
Posts: 1305
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:20 pm
Team(s) Supported: .
England and Warwickshire.

Also tend to follow any former/current/prospective England players.

606 Username: matt_h88

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Aidan11 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:08 pm

I cant keep pace again.
2010 Ind v Oz fantasy league
2011-12 internal Prem footy prediction league
2012 US Open Golf Prediction league
2012 Eng vs WI ODIs fantasy league
2012 TV Cup Winner
2012 CC Final Placings Prediction league
2014 Eng v India Test FL
2014 Royal London One Day Cup FL
2014 Ryder Cup FL
2015 Ashes Test FL
2015 County Championship Division 1 FL
2016 SA v Eng Test FL
2016 Eng v SL Test FL
2016 Eng v SL ODI FL
2022 County Championship Div 2 FL
2023 County Championship Div 2 FL
User avatar
Aidan11
 
Posts: 48590
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Team(s) Supported: Durham CCC, Hartlepool United

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Aidan11 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:12 pm

Oh and Cook's an idiot.
2010 Ind v Oz fantasy league
2011-12 internal Prem footy prediction league
2012 US Open Golf Prediction league
2012 Eng vs WI ODIs fantasy league
2012 TV Cup Winner
2012 CC Final Placings Prediction league
2014 Eng v India Test FL
2014 Royal London One Day Cup FL
2014 Ryder Cup FL
2015 Ashes Test FL
2015 County Championship Division 1 FL
2016 SA v Eng Test FL
2016 Eng v SL Test FL
2016 Eng v SL ODI FL
2022 County Championship Div 2 FL
2023 County Championship Div 2 FL
User avatar
Aidan11
 
Posts: 48590
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Team(s) Supported: Durham CCC, Hartlepool United

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby braveneutral » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:26 pm

I shan't disclose in case it gives away where my sensitive information has come from.

Nice to see you posting idle.
Asia Cup 2012 guru
SA vs Oz 2011 combined guru
SA vs Bangladesh Tests guru
NZ vs WI Tests guru
2014 French Open guru
T20 Blast 2014 guru
India vs WI ODIs 2014 guru
2016 French Open guru
2016 Wimbledon guru
2016 RL50 Cup guru
Premier League Final Placings Prediction League 2016/7 guru
England v SA ODIs 2017 guru
Guru.

D/L wrote:Words fail me for once.


17/04/17 - 'The day that history was made'

20/04/17 - Better than Bolt.
User avatar
braveneutral
 
Posts: 20726
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 5:22 pm
Location: In between the hemispheres
Team(s) Supported: Northants amongst others.

I suppose.

At times.

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:30 pm

Hi Idlebrain. I go two ways on the IPL. I think the senior players should have been given a little leeway to allow them to play in it. They all wanted to, and as far as I recall, only Cook hasn't put his name forward. But, given he had an England contract, KP could hardly complain if he was expected to be available for all England games. He might have been accommodated better, and arguably, that would have made the situation better. But he was hardly wronged. However, this disagreement led the ECB to try and protect their central contracts by damaging Pietersen's reputation. To destroy his credibility. Which did a lot of harm, and set a pattern for how the press would go on treating him. And led to the events of 2012.

His chapter on the IPL is awful. Full of faulty reasoning, barely credible assumptions, self pity and a lack of understanding of the feelings of others. For example, others might have been jealous of his contract, but wouldn't that make you want to keep quiet about it, to protect them from a feeling of inadequacy? Apparently not. As a player who had played many years for England though, I think the ECB might have given him (or Swann, or Bell) a little bit of what they wanted.
I always say that everybody's right.
User avatar
Arthur Crabtree
 
Posts: 89003
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 12:52 pm
Location: Nottingham
Team(s) Supported: Yorkshire.

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Aidan11 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:39 pm

Graham Gooch speaking at a function this week said if he gave KP a £1000 to disappear for a year he would consider it money well spent.
2010 Ind v Oz fantasy league
2011-12 internal Prem footy prediction league
2012 US Open Golf Prediction league
2012 Eng vs WI ODIs fantasy league
2012 TV Cup Winner
2012 CC Final Placings Prediction league
2014 Eng v India Test FL
2014 Royal London One Day Cup FL
2014 Ryder Cup FL
2015 Ashes Test FL
2015 County Championship Division 1 FL
2016 SA v Eng Test FL
2016 Eng v SL Test FL
2016 Eng v SL ODI FL
2022 County Championship Div 2 FL
2023 County Championship Div 2 FL
User avatar
Aidan11
 
Posts: 48590
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Team(s) Supported: Durham CCC, Hartlepool United

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:43 pm

Good post Matt above. When it comes to summing up my thoughts on the book, I might just bump up that.

Not sure I agree about the Downton point. Surely he shouldn't have come in with preconceptions? And should have taken time to weigh up what happened once the bad feeling had subsided from the whitewash, and he got to know the people involved.

Though really I feel the new coach should have decided whether or not they wanted Kevin.
I always say that everybody's right.
User avatar
Arthur Crabtree
 
Posts: 89003
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 12:52 pm
Location: Nottingham
Team(s) Supported: Yorkshire.

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby meninblue » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:44 pm

Prior, Bell, Bresnan, Swann, Dimitri, Broad, Luke, Alex, Morgan, KP have all listed themselves for bidding process in various IPL seasons.

Bresnan and Broad were actually selected by franchisees. KP has been selected every year and in fact captained entire season for Royal Challengers Bangalore and Delhi daredevils whenever fit apart form playing for other . Morgan played in lot of IPL seasons. Luke pplayed for Pune warriors. Dimi played for Kings 11 iirc. Bell,Swann and Prior were never purchased. But only KP is said to have greed towards playing in IPL although so many England players made themselves available for bidding an some actually were part of franchisees. So to get criticised for being in IPL was double standards.
Last edited by meninblue on Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Test FL's - 8 , ODI and Tests Combo FL's - 1, ODI World Cup - 1, ODI FL's - 7, ODI and T20i combo FL's - 1 ,
T20 Franchisee FL's - 7, T20i Cup FL's- 1, T20 FL's- 5 , 50 Overs Domestic FL's - 1, 40 Overs Domestic FL's- 1
User avatar
meninblue
 
Posts: 25957
Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:36 am

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Aidan11 » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:45 pm

I have a feeling once the dust settles KP is going to be a forgotten man.
2010 Ind v Oz fantasy league
2011-12 internal Prem footy prediction league
2012 US Open Golf Prediction league
2012 Eng vs WI ODIs fantasy league
2012 TV Cup Winner
2012 CC Final Placings Prediction league
2014 Eng v India Test FL
2014 Royal London One Day Cup FL
2014 Ryder Cup FL
2015 Ashes Test FL
2015 County Championship Division 1 FL
2016 SA v Eng Test FL
2016 Eng v SL Test FL
2016 Eng v SL ODI FL
2022 County Championship Div 2 FL
2023 County Championship Div 2 FL
User avatar
Aidan11
 
Posts: 48590
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:38 pm
Team(s) Supported: Durham CCC, Hartlepool United

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby Slipstream » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:56 pm

Aidan11 wrote:I have a feeling once the dust settles KP is going to be a forgotten man.


How many years will it take for the dust to settle?
User avatar
Slipstream
 
Posts: 1754
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:36 pm

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby sussexpob » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:57 pm

http://www.espncricinfo.com/england/con ... 88649.html

Seems strange that people seem to remember Flower only from 2008-2011... its like the last 3 years never happened
2010 French Open fantasy league guru 2010 Wimbledon fantasy league guru 2014 Masters golf fantasy guru 2015 Players Championship FL Guru 2016 Masters Golf Fantasy Guru

And a hat and bra to you too, my good sirs!
sussexpob
 
Posts: 40086
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2010 5:14 pm
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Team(s) Supported: Sussex and England Cricket, Vålerenga Fotball/FC Barcelona/Seagulls! ....
England and Norway at everything else

Re: Kevin Pietersen's Autobiography.

Postby idlebrain » Sat Oct 11, 2014 5:58 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:Hi Idlebrain. I go two ways on the IPL. I think the senior players should have been given a little leeway to allow them to play in it. They all wanted to, and as far as I recall, only Cook hasn't put his name forward. But, given he had an England contract, KP could hardly complain if he was expected to be available for all England games. He might have been accommodated better, and arguably, that would have made the situation better. But he was hardly wronged. However, this disagreement led the ECB to try and protect their central contracts by damaging Pietersen's reputation. To destroy his credibility. Which did a lot of harm, and set a pattern for how the press would go on treating him. And led to the events of 2012.

His chapter on the IPL is awful. Full of faulty reasoning, barely credible assumptions, self pity and a lack of understanding of the feelings of others. For example, others might have been jealous of his contract, but wouldn't that make you want to keep quiet about it, to protect them from a feeling of inadequacy? Apparently not. As a player who had played many years for England though, I think the ECB might have given him (or Swann, or Bell) a little bit of what they wanted.


Probably ECB might not have thought it would be a good idea - especially given KP's superstar appeal in IPL coupled with his obvious love of IPL and their own aversion to IPL / BCCI those days. Probably from the ECB's PoV, thats a dangerous path with no guarantee that there would not be further demands down the road, ultimately resulting in players wanting to become freelance a la Gayle, Bravo etc. (Admittedly slim chance for a board like ECB with strong revenues).

Incidentally, now that BCCI & ECB are working closely in the new setup, I am curious to see how this affects ECB's attitude vis-a-vis IPL (and the participation of English Players in IPL). Perhaps the next edition of IPL in 2015 might give some clues on this.
idlebrain
 
Posts: 38
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 10:48 am

PreviousNext

Return to International Cricket

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 59 guests