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Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 1:59 pm
by Making_Splinters
There seems to be a massively inflated analysis of young Stokes. The lad has barely played any cricket for England!
It's easy to get excited about the prospect of having a genuine all rounder in the side again, but, struth let's actually give him the chance to play a solid year of international cricket before making judgements.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:31 pm
by meninblue
Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:41 pm
by Making_Splinters
clubcricketeradi wrote:Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
In three Tests, and has played a single innings of note in the ODIs going for plenty of runs with his bowling to boot.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 3:50 pm
by meninblue
Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
In three Tests, and has played a single innings of note in the ODIs going for plenty of runs with his bowling to boot.
Agree to disagree.
For me it is not possible to name any other player from England apart from Broad in tests and Morgan (maybe) in ODI's who contributed better than Ben.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:12 pm
by Making_Splinters
clubcricketeradi wrote:Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
In three Tests, and has played a single innings of note in the ODIs going for plenty of runs with his bowling to boot.
Agree to disagree.
For me it is not possible to name any other player from England apart from Broad in tests and Morgan (maybe) in ODI's who contributed better than Ben.
Being the best in a fairly terrible performance doesn't mean much. Poor old Stokes is being over hyped in all quarters at present. We need to let him have a decent run to show what he can do over an extended period of time before laying on all the praise.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:44 pm
by meninblue
Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
In three Tests, and has played a single innings of note in the ODIs going for plenty of runs with his bowling to boot.
Agree to disagree.
For me it is not possible to name any other player from England apart from Broad in tests and Morgan (maybe) in ODI's who contributed better than Ben.
Being the best in a fairly terrible performance doesn't mean much. Poor old Stokes is being over hyped in all quarters at present. We need to let him have a decent run to show what he can do over an extended period of time before laying on all the praise.
imo he has shown that he can take five fer in both tests as well as ODI formats. That is excellent ability and performance as well. Plus the 100 in debut series on a pitch with wide crack .I think that also came on day 4 or day 5 . His performance imo is not great but definitely above average. I am not hyping him by saying great performance like others maybe saying.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 5:11 pm
by D/L
clubcricketeradi wrote:Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Making_Splinters wrote:clubcricketeradi wrote:Nothing inflated at all. He imo was the top 2 English cricketers in both tests (broad and Ben) and ODI series ( Ben and Morgan).
In three Tests, and has played a single innings of note in the ODIs going for plenty of runs with his bowling to boot.
Agree to disagree.
For me it is not possible to name any other player from England apart from Broad in tests and Morgan (maybe) in ODI's who contributed better than Ben.
Being the best in a fairly terrible performance doesn't mean much. Poor old Stokes is being over hyped in all quarters at present. We need to let him have a decent run to show what he can do over an extended period of time before laying on all the praise.
imo he has shown that he can take five fer in both tests as well as ODI formats. That is excellent ability and performance as well. Plus the 100 in debut series on a pitch with wide crack .I think that also came on day 4 or day 5 . His performance imo is not great but definitely above average.
I am not hyping him by saying great performance like others maybe saying.
That appears to be exactly what is being done. Even if figures suggest that Stokes may have been one of our best two performers in both tests and ODIs, he had very little to compete with. Other context is provided by the fortune he has enjoyed in his short career so far.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Sun Jan 26, 2014 6:16 pm
by Arthur Crabtree
I don't see any hyping going on here, just a recognition of some encouraging performances.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:52 am
by meninblue
If an all rounder has taken 2 wickets per ODI innings then it is definitely above average . That is what a specialist bowler should be doing.Let us not even consider the 105 runs ? he scored.We are just talking wickets here.
Englands highest wicket taker has taken 10 wickets @ eco rate 5.76
Australia's highest wicket taker has taken 11 wickets @ eco rate 6.08
He definitely has performed very well even considering all bowlers of both teams who bowled on same wickets and same conditions.
http://stats.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes ... ype=serieshttp://stats.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes ... ype=series
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:17 pm
by D/L
Arthur Crabtree wrote:I don't see any hyping going on here, just a recognition of some encouraging performances.
Something more usually expressed in match threads rather than in one devoted to a single player, perhaps.
Didn't Prior have his own hype thread as well?
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:19 pm
by Gingerfinch
D/L wrote:Arthur Crabtree wrote:I don't see any hyping going on here, just a recognition of some encouraging performances.
Something more usually expressed in match threads rather than in one devoted to a single player, perhaps.
Didn't Prior have his own hype thread as well?
And Bresnan of course
![Wink ;)](./images/smilies/icon_e_wink.gif)
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:27 pm
by D/L
Dr Robert wrote:D/L wrote:Arthur Crabtree wrote:I don't see any hyping going on here, just a recognition of some encouraging performances.
Something more usually expressed in match threads rather than in one devoted to a single player, perhaps.
Didn't Prior have his own hype thread as well?
And Bresnan of course
![Wink ;)](./images/smilies/icon_e_wink.gif)
His own thread, yes, but hardly one of hype.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 12:38 pm
by Gingerfinch
Taken from the OP's article.
Obviously he'll struggle to maintain these stats, but is he the head of the next generation of International all-rounders?
A little bit over the top, and not to different from the praise Stokes is getting. As for Stokes. Potential is there, which could see him be a England regular. I won't go no further than that. Also with Stokes, many, including me, like his feisty, fighting character, which was lacking from some this winter. I guess he's like a breath of fresh air.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm
by Albondiga
Before there are too many stats -- I would like to make a point. ------ you don't get a hundred and take a five fer in a test match against the Aussies unless you have something about you ---- he has made a great start.
Re: Ben Stokes
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Posted:
Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:29 am
by Making_Splinters
My issue is two fold: Firstly I think Stokes' performances are being somewhat overstated, particularly in the ODI series. Secondly no young English player has had a lasting impact since Cook came in to the side.
Cautious optimism at best.