How Good Is Timothy Bresnan?

[Slipstream]

Onions did get dropped in SA. Average there 45.75. I would prefer Bresnan to Onions.

Was he dropped or was it becuase he injured his back, I thought it was the latter.

That must have been the start of his back problem but he was selected for Bangladesh two months later.

[meninblue]

Guys,some posts have been moved here:

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=5345&p=216254#p216254

[OffStumpYorker]

Onions did get dropped in SA. Average there 45.75. I would prefer Bresnan to Onions.

Was he dropped or was it becuase he injured his back, I thought it was the latter.

That must have been the start of his back problem but he was selected for Bangladesh two months later.

I think he did his back during one of the ODI series or warm up matches, and was sent home shortly after.

[rich1uk]

Guys,some posts have been moved here:

viewtopic.php?f=10&p=216360#p216360

adi i really dont understand why you have moved posts from this thread and that link doesn't show where they have been moved to anyway

this thread is about bresnan and his potential to become a genuine all-rounder so why is discussing other all-rounders, who he will have to be judged against, off-topic and need to be removed ?

[meninblue]

Guys,some posts have been moved here:

viewtopic.php?f=10&p=216360#p216360

adi i really dont understand why you have moved posts from this thread and that link doesn't show where they have been moved to anyway

this thread is about bresnan and his potential to become a genuine all-rounder so why is discussing other all-rounders, who he will have to be judged against, off-topic and need to be removed ?

Try the link again. I could sense that the topic was moving towards another discussion, hence the posts were moved, not removed.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Me too Adi!

[meninblue]

Me too Adi!

Okay, but i hope the link is accessible?

viewtopic.php?f=10&p=216360#p216360

[rich1uk]

Guys,some posts have been moved here:

viewtopic.php?f=10&p=216360#p216360

adi i really dont understand why you have moved posts from this thread and that link doesn't show where they have been moved to anyway

this thread is about bresnan and his potential to become a genuine all-rounder so why is discussing other all-rounders, who he will have to be judged against, off-topic and need to be removed ?

Try the link again. I could sense that the topic was moving towards another discussion, hence the posts were moved, not removed.

well why not just give a gentle reminder to make sure people stay on topic, its not as if even the little deviation was really a big deal imo

[meninblue]

Rich, i get your point. But reminding about the topic will mean poster might discontinue the debate even though they want to carry it forward. Moving the post ensures that the posts relevant to other threads can still be debated.

[ddb]

Me too Adi!

Yeah it makes you log out. Not sure what's happening with that.

[shankycricket]

Me too Adi!

Yeah it makes you log out. Not sure what's happening with that.

Yeah it happened to me too.

[Cynomis]

Sport, I sense most discussants on this thread would disagree with you.

[OMM!]

Kallis' figures are sensational, but 270 Test wickets in 160 odd games isn't exactly magnificent. Sure his average is pretty good, but it can also be quite deceptive as well. I'd wager if he just bowled for his career, he'd probably have a higher average than 32, as he wouldn't be the 5th/part-time option.

It also raises the question of how you compare a bowling all-rounder (like Bresnan, Khan, Botham etc.) to a batting all-rounder (like Kallis and Sobers).

A bowling all-rounder who averages 35 with the bat in Test cricket is doing fantastically well, but a world class batting all-rounder could average 50+ as a batsman. While a batting all-rounder could average mid-30's with the ball and be doing sensationally well, but these days a world class bowling all-rounder, would still only average about mid-20's at best as a Test match bowler. So you can't just compare gaps between averages as it's not very accurate.

I guess the best way to judge an all-rounder is on their runs/wickets per innings records. That shows how involved they are as an "all-rounder".

So rather than look at averages, we should be looking at what they contribute to each innings on average. Bresnan, for example, averages an impressive 40 or so runs an innings when batting, while he takes just over 2 wickets an innings when fielding. Consistent. Jacques Kallis, on the other hand, averages 49 runs or so run an innings when he bats, while he takes just over a wicket an innings when he is fielding. Is 9 runs, worth a wicket? Probably not!

[SaintPowelly]

IMO, If your batting average is better than your bowling average, your an all rounder

[OMM!]

Even if you average say 51 with the bat, but 50 with the ball?!

What if you average 21 with the ball and say 22 with the bat?!

I'd say they describe batsmen who can turn their arm over and bowlers who can bat a bit. Not all-rounders.