Who's Sorry Now: Down by the Riverside

[westoelad]

https://audioboom.com/posts/6333620-graham-onions-int
Certainly from this it appears that he's got what he wants at another County. It's why Jennings is leaving, if he is , that interests me.

[captaincolly]

https://audioboom.com/posts/6333620-graham-onions-int
Certainly from this it appears that he's got what he wants at another County. It's why Jennings is leaving, if he is , that interests me.

Very nice words from him, a shame the two parties couldn't come to a suitable agreement.
If KJ goes he'll probably come out with the usual platitudes about ' exciting opportunities' and needing ' new challenges'
Colly has gone very quiet, wonder what he makes of all these departures.

[wearside willow]

https://audioboom.com/posts/6333620-graham-onions-int
Certainly from this it appears that he's got what he wants at another County. It's why Jennings is leaving, if he is , that interests me.

Very nice words from him, a shame the two parties couldn't come to a suitable agreement.
If KJ goes he'll probably come out with the usual platitudes about ' exciting opportunities' and needing ' new challenges'
Colly has gone very quiet, wonder what he makes of all these departures.

To be honest he is probably thinking if it goes pear shaped for England this winter (which it very likely could) there will be changes and Colly knows he is in pole position to get a key coaching role with England probably as head coach of the one day team. So i better not say nowt because I could be off as well before the start of next season.

[captaincolly]

https://audioboom.com/posts/6333620-graham-onions-int
Certainly from this it appears that he's got what he wants at another County. It's why Jennings is leaving, if he is , that interests me.

Very nice words from him, a shame the two parties couldn't come to a suitable agreement.
If KJ goes he'll probably come out with the usual platitudes about ' exciting opportunities' and needing ' new challenges'
Colly has gone very quiet, wonder what he makes of all these departures.

To be honest he is probably thinking if it goes pear shaped for England this winter (which it very likely could) there will be changes and Colly knows he is in pole position to get a key coaching role with England probably as head coach of the one day team. So i better not say nowt because I could be off as well before the start of next season.

Yep, think a debacle in Australia is a distinct possibility and they are keen on him to get more involved in any case so it's probably best for him to not say too much.
Lewis has made a few comments on the cricinfo match report but appears to be hedging his bets - says he's not sure if Bunny would have been given the deal he wanted if the ECB hadn't imposed the dreaded sanctions.

[wearside willow]

I think regardless of the ECB sanction Durham in their own mind have a similar figure that they do not want to go above for a few seasons. I think if it was not for his age and injury record they would have quite happily given him a 2 year deal.
Even without the sanctions Durham would never have been able to retain all the players they have lost in the last 12 months on the kind of salaries top county cricketers get paid. They are actually a victim of there own fantastic production line of quality cricketers.

[captaincolly]

I think regardless of the ECB sanction Durham in their own mind have a similar figure that they do not want to go above for a few seasons. I think if it was not for his age and injury record they would have quite happily given him a 2 year deal.
Even without the sanctions Durham would never have been able to retain all the players they have lost in the last 12 months on the kind of salaries top county cricketers get paid. They are actually a victim of there own fantastic production line of quality cricketers.

I wonder what happened though? Before Rocky and Borthwick went we hadn't lost any players we wanted to retain in years- now the floodgates are open.
Instead of applying draconian sanctions and setting precedents FTECB surely should have been trying to ensure a system that worked so well was not in any way damaged - applying any playing sanctions was always going to be counterproductive.
Durham had a group of young players in a team that was constantly in division 1 despite severe financial difficulties. I'm sure playing together at that level was a crucial factor in their development. Borthwick's loss of form at Surrey might just be coincidental after having so many good seasons but at Durham he was a key player whereas at Surrey he's not.
Same might happen to Coggers - his major problem is staying fit but if he had stayed here he'd be an automatic choice and probably would have been persevered with as T20 skipper. At Notts will he retain his place if he has a poor run of form?
Same might apply to Jennings! If we had a stronger squad he could have been dropped.

[KingOttis]

Maybe I'm on my own here, but for me, this news beggars belief. I know that Onions maybe isn't the force of his peak years, and it's true he has started to pick up more niggling injuries. But to lose a club legend who has represented us so well for all these years - and who is averaging 23 with the ball this season - because we couldn't agree a two year contract is ridiculous in my opinion. TWO YEARS! Jesus wept. We have a squad so decimated that it can hold team meetings in a phone box, but are willing to let a proven performer leave in this way.
In addition, didn't Coughlin and Jennings sign new contracts last year? Wasn't that supposed to be the good news to counter-balance the departures of Stoneman and Borthwick? Now they're gone/going too. Seems as if Durham have dusted off their copy of "The Neville Chamberlain Guide to Negotiation" and are following it to the letter in all contract talks.
I really hoped we'd come back stronger after the gutting events of the close season, but it just seems to be one body blow after another - some sadly self inflicted.

[captaincolly]

Maybe I'm on my own here, but for me, this news beggars belief. I know that Onions maybe isn't the force of his peak years, and it's true he has started to pick up more niggling injuries. But to lose a club legend who has represented us so well for all these years - and who is averaging 23 with the ball this season - because we couldn't agree a two year contract is ridiculous in my opinion. TWO YEARS! Jesus wept. We have a squad so decimated that it can hold team meetings in a phone box, but are willing to let a proven performer leave in this way.
In addition, didn't Coughlin and Jennings sign new contracts last year? Wasn't that supposed to be the good news to counter-balance the departures of Stoneman and Borthwick? Now they're gone/going too. Seems as if Durham have dusted off their copy of "The Neville Chamberlain Guide to Negotiation" and are following it to the letter in all contract talks.
I really hoped we'd come back stronger after the gutting events of the close season, but it just seems to be one body blow after another - some sadly self inflicted.

I think the contracts for Coggers and Coughlin will have had the get out clauses inserted by their agents - likely thing is they would not have signed them otherwise. Were they not signed before the sanctions but there was a feeling that they may have triggered the release clauses after FTECB sent us down? It might be that neither of them could leave last year because I'm sure Lewis said something recently about the relegation clauses only applying to being in division 2 in 2018.

I share your misgivings about Onions. Given the departures of others and the likely difficulty in finding top quality replacements I think it's more risky letting him go than it would have been to retain him. My initial thought that him asking for 2 years plus a coaching role was a bit too much but it appears as if Lancs ( possible runners up in div 1 ) are going to give him what he wants.

[westoelad]

Maybe I'm on my own here, but for me, this news beggars belief. I know that Onions maybe isn't the force of his peak years, and it's true he has started to pick up more niggling injuries. But to lose a club legend who has represented us so well for all these years - and who is averaging 23 with the ball this season - because we couldn't agree a two year contract is ridiculous in my opinion. TWO YEARS! Jesus wept. We have a squad so decimated that it can hold team meetings in a phone box, but are willing to let a proven performer leave in this way.
In addition, didn't Coughlin and Jennings sign new contracts last year? Wasn't that supposed to be the good news to counter-balance the departures of Stoneman and Borthwick? Now they're gone/going too. Seems as if Durham have dusted off their copy of "The Neville Chamberlain Guide to Negotiation" and are following it to the letter in all contract talks.
I really hoped we'd come back stronger after the gutting events of the close season, but it just seems to be one body blow after another - some sadly self inflicted.

Durham offered Onions a 2 year contract - with the prudent rider that he was fit enough to take up the 2nd year. If ,as he claims, he wants to and loves playing for Durham then why didn't he accept what is surely a fair concession?
Durham are limited in contract negotiations by a stringent salary cap- that's not self- inflicted it's FTECB inflicted. Durham are stronger this season with the emergence of Steel, Clark and Potts. The form in the 2nd half of the season has been promotion form apart from the last 2 days v Sussex.

[KingOttis]

Maybe I'm on my own here, but for me, this news beggars belief. I know that Onions maybe isn't the force of his peak years, and it's true he has started to pick up more niggling injuries. But to lose a club legend who has represented us so well for all these years - and who is averaging 23 with the ball this season - because we couldn't agree a two year contract is ridiculous in my opinion. TWO YEARS! Jesus wept. We have a squad so decimated that it can hold team meetings in a phone box, but are willing to let a proven performer leave in this way.
In addition, didn't Coughlin and Jennings sign new contracts last year? Wasn't that supposed to be the good news to counter-balance the departures of Stoneman and Borthwick? Now they're gone/going too. Seems as if Durham have dusted off their copy of "The Neville Chamberlain Guide to Negotiation" and are following it to the letter in all contract talks.
I really hoped we'd come back stronger after the gutting events of the close season, but it just seems to be one body blow after another - some sadly self inflicted.

Durham offered Onions a 2 year contract - with the prudent rider that he was fit enough to take up the 2nd year. If ,as he claims, he wants to and loves playing for Durham then why didn't he accept what is surely a fair concession?
Durham are limited in contract negotiations by a stringent salary cap- that's not self- inflicted it's FTECB inflicted. Durham are stronger this season with the emergence of Steel, Clark and Potts. The form in the 2nd half of the season has been promotion form apart from the last 2 days v Sussex.

It was reported that Onions/Durham had agreed financial terms, but the sticking point was the details of the second year of the contract - if that's the case then the salary cap wouldn't have any effect. If it was a Harmy-style 4 year deal, then I agree, built in safeguards would make sense, but for a two year deal I think it's a gamble easily worth taking. If I'd put in the length and quality of service that Graham has, and I was offered this deal I'd be pretty insulted.
We have had a crap deal from FTECB, and the effects just seem to keep snowballing - but I stand by the "self inflicted" comment. Some of the decision making around the club has been appalling over the past few years, and this in my opinion is another bad decision, badly handled.

[westoelad]

Yes it would have been a gamble - if it was worth taking is an individual opinion. The insistence of the follow up coaching contract was probably the biggest difficulty when there isn't a coaching vacancy. You can't simply create one without impinging on existing contracts.

[wearside willow]

Always an emotive decision when a team get rid of a great player who is still good but not the player he was.

[captaincolly]

Confirmation now that Jennings is going!
http://www.durhamccc.co.uk/news/jenning ... ve-durham/

[Arthur Crabtree]

There seems to be a disconnection between younger players who are criticised for maximising their potential while they still have the opportunity, and older players who are given diminished contracts the second they falter. It's not practical to keep on players beyond the point where they weaken the side, which is pretty ruthless Darwinism for the individual concerned. But surely given that harshness, the players should be morally free to seek the most advantageous environment for their skills, prosperity and longevity. That's a liberty we all exploit, though thankfully in more forgiving circumstances.

[captaincolly]

There seems to be a disconnection between younger players who are criticised for maximising their potential while they still have the opportunity, and older players who are given diminished contracts the second they falter. It's not practical to keep on players beyond the point where they weaken the side, which is pretty ruthless Darwinism for the individual concerned. But surely given that harshness, the players should be morally free to seek the most advantageous environment for their skills, prosperity and longevity. That's a liberty we all exploit, though thankfully in more forgiving circumstances.

Yes, it's always a tricky argument and impossible not to be hypocritical - eg I criticise Coggers for going while thinking Durham should have retained Onions.