2016 Hampshire Thread

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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby mark the hawk » Mon Oct 03, 2016 3:29 pm

http://www.bbc.com/sport/cricket/37541136

Details here , that is a fair old punishment though , I can't see how it will A help Durham clear their debt to the ECB or attract any players
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby budgetmeansbudget » Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:35 pm

Blimey, just heard the announcement on Talk Sport.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby st_brendy » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:11 pm

Not exactly something worth celebrating. You have to feel for Durham.

(Although as I've thought since the moment this was suggested last week, I'm not at all surprised that it's us to stay up rather Kent to go up. That is completely right. It's 2 up and 1 down, not 3 up and 2 down. Never understood why that aspect was ever even up for debate)
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:14 pm

Yes, I assumed Hants would stay up.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby sussexpob » Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:29 pm

Have to say, Kent not being promoted in a position which traditionally always has..... ludicrous.

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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 10:53 pm

Stroke of luck for Hants undeniably. But rightly their stroke of luck. If there was any justification at all for relegating Durham, it was because they hadn't been playing on a level playing field with their competitors (as if anyone is, but that's a different argument). Most closely, they weren't competing fairly with other teams in their league. And Hants played Durham for their own survival in the last game of the season.

And as someone says above, CC1 relegates two teams this season, that's the arrangement. And so, it has relegated two.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby sussexpob » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:00 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:Stroke of luck for Hants undeniably. But rightly their stroke of luck. If there was any justification at all for relegating Durham, it was because they hadn't been playing on a level playing field with their competitors (as if anyone is, but that's a different argument). Most closely, they weren't competing fairly with other teams in their league. And Hants played Durham for their own survival in the last game of the season.

And as someone says above, CC1 relegates two teams this season, that's the arrangement. And so, it has relegated two.



Dont agree.

The ECB reduced the number of teams promoted this year to the lowest ever in the history of two division structures. That was already unfair to Div 2 teams, and imo its right to reward a better season than one that ended with relegation.In every year other than this disastrous one where the ECB took a giant **** on Div 2, Kent would already be there, and should be there.

As for the point about unfair competition....... arent we talking about a team that had to have the local council buy their ground for £7 million pound so they could still exist?

Either way, the financial problems at Durham would not be built in one year..... can Sussex be reinstated in Div 1 because their unfair side beat us last year? Of course not. Once you go down that road, its long and simply unquantifiable to assess what is fair and what advantages were had.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:22 pm

I did say the idea of a level playing field is dubious. But that's the intension.

Many won't like the way this season was set up, and the changes to the divisions. But arguments along those lines were lost when the season started.

There's a difference between Sussex going down, having played a season in C2 and failing to get promoted, and Hants who failed in direct competition, even down to the last game. This feels like a blind alley. Each event triggers off its own new narrative which becomes entangled with other new occurrences. But the last thing that happened can more easily be righted with fewer consequences. This happens all the time.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby sussexpob » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:25 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:I did say the idea of a level playing field is dubious. But that's the intension.

Many won't like the way this season was set up, and the changes to the divisions. But arguments along those lines were lost when the season started.

There's a difference between Sussex going down, having played a season in C2 and failing to get promoted, and Hants who failed in direct competition, even down to the last game. This feels like a blind alley. Each event triggers off its own new narrative which becomes entangled with other new occurrences. But the last thing that happened can more easily be righted with fewer consequences. This happens all the time.


Indeed, which was my point. I was illustrating why the argument of unfair competition is wrong.

I just think the right result is Kent going up. It wasnt right that the ECB when to a 8-10 division split and only one team went up this year, this is a way to correct the integrity of the Div 2 system
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:30 pm

Probably a governing body should have rules in place to cover these eventualities before they happen...
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby westoelad » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:31 pm

The stated rule for relegation is the 2 teams with the lowest points. Durham weren't one of those teams. They were demoted for issues of finance -they didn't meet the criteria for relegation.
Hants, Yorks, Glamorgan, Northants and Warks have all recently had to seek bail outs because they weren't self- financing. So how didn't these clubs create unlevel playing fields? And why did they avoid sanctions?
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:32 pm

Intention! Argh.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Dr Cricket » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:40 pm

westoelad wrote:The stated rule for relegation is the 2 teams with the lowest points. Durham weren't one of those teams. They were demoted for issues of finance -they didn't meet the criteria for relegation.
Hants, Yorks, Glamorgan, Northants and Warks have all recently had to seek bail outs because they weren't self- financing. So how didn't these clubs create unlevel playing fields? And why did they avoid sanctions?


Really durham should be checking if they actually allowed to be relegated if they are allowed to be relegated why wasn't the rules applied to other teams, what ever happens Durham got a pretty good case or chance of winning since if it was allowed then the blame will go to the ECB for not applying the penalties before and giving a way too harsh sanction this time that doesn't follow the trend of past sanctions of nothing.
If they are not allowed to be relegated then Durham stay in Div 1 next season but probably keep the deduction.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:43 pm

westoelad wrote:The stated rule for relegation is the 2 teams with the lowest points. Durham weren't one of those teams. They were demoted for issues of finance -they didn't meet the criteria for relegation.
Hants, Yorks, Glamorgan, Northants and Warks have all recently had to seek bail outs because they weren't self- financing. So how didn't these clubs create unlevel playing fields? And why did they avoid sanctions?



I was saying there is never a level playing field. I don't agree with what they've done. But the argument about lowest points doesn't seem an issue. The ECB could just have fined DCCC 50 points to overcome that.

Personally I see the ECB's role as custodians of the game, and the idea of competition as purely something that takes place between bat and ball. It should be their role to guide and advise, not to carry out harmful punishments. I see the counties as an organic whole who should be working together towards mutual ends. I also think the ECB have made plenty of money out of the counties, however indirectly, and could do more to support them. I suspect they have an ulterior motive here.

I realise my point of view couldn't be further from how the ECB does business.
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Re: 2016 Hampshire Thread

Postby sussexpob » Mon Oct 03, 2016 11:44 pm

westoelad wrote:The stated rule for relegation is the 2 teams with the lowest points. Durham weren't one of those teams. They were demoted for issues of finance -they didn't meet the criteria for relegation.
Hants, Yorks, Glamorgan, Northants and Warks have all recently had to seek bail outs because they weren't self- financing. So how didn't these clubs create unlevel playing fields? And why did they avoid sanctions?



Did anyother club seek financing from the neutral custodians of the game?
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