ODI Series & T20i, England v New Zealand, 2015.

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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby sussexpob » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:46 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:McCullum is the man to do that (reply to Sussex). Bowling wide at Buttler, giving him width... was an incredibly high risk strategy at that point. To do so with one slip representing your chance of reward was an anti-McCullum decision. Arguably, he should have had three slips. His philosophy demanded it..


If one of the most aggressive captains in the game didnt have the balls to do it, then calling his decision "defensive" might be a little harsh? To be fair, New Zealand got two wickets not long after Buttler got there.... but England just kept attacking, and had enough runs on the board to make the risk worth it
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:54 pm

Well, I was trying to be a bit provocative in how I phrased it. But as an armchair disciple of Brendon's philosophy,I do think he lost his purity there a little.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby yorker_129-7 » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:55 pm

Calling it, that's England's best all-round ODI display since they played the West Indies at the Rose Bowl in 2011. Totally dominating the opposition.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby Arthur Crabtree » Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:01 pm

England have dominated bowling first many times. Not so much batting first.

I'm going to try and call it as being a product of it not being part of the Flower/Moores tendency. A team who had identified 320 as a probably winning score just wouldn't have had any reason to score 400 plus.

Root was superb, attacking when everything he has known as an England player would have told him to consolidate. Under Flower/Moores, strategy would have demanded he did consolidate. He would have had to get to 150 after 30 with wickets in hand.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby hopeforthebest » Tue Jun 09, 2015 11:07 pm

Arthur Crabtree wrote:England have dominated bowling first many times. Not so much batting first.

I'm going to try and call it as being a product of it not being part of the Flower/Moores tendency. A team who had identified 320 as a probably winning score just wouldn't have had any reason to score 400 plus.

Root was superb, attacking when everything he has known as an England player would have told him to consolidate. Under Flower/Moores, strategy would have demanded he did consolidate. He would have had to get to 150 after 30 with wickets in hand.


What emphasizes your point AC is that the main core of the team is the one that was so heavily critisizes during the recent WC. Now the Cook issue and the coach have gone the players are more confident to play positively. Whether this is just a one off or a real change we've yet to discover.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby bigfluffylemon » Tue Jun 09, 2015 11:45 pm

I did a double take seeing that result. I thought cricinfo had got England and New Zealand's scores mixed up. Wow.

Hopefully this is the catalyst to give Rashid a decent run in the side. I like Moeen but he's not a good enough spinner to be the primary option, and with Stokes as an allrounder there simply isn't room for Moeen too.

This is what everyone's been calling for. It can't and won't happen every time, but it's a step in the right direction. Let's hope they can keep the positive intent.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby The Waugh Twins » Wed Jun 10, 2015 12:45 am

Just got back from Vegas baby.

I've felt better, but England hasn't. :Eng:

Nice job, but they would have had 500 if Pietersen had been playing. :)
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby budgetmeansbudget » Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:36 am

bigfluffylemon wrote:I did a double take seeing that result. I thought cricinfo had got England and New Zealand's scores mixed up. Wow.

Hopefully this is the catalyst to give Rashid a decent run in the side. I like Moeen but he's not a good enough spinner to be the primary option, and with Stokes as an allrounder there simply isn't room for Moeen too.

This is what everyone's been calling for. It can't and won't happen every time, but it's a step in the right direction. Let's hope they can keep the positive intent.

And the test side?
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby Gingerfinch » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:08 am

Amid all this positivity, I still believe there's a place somewhere, for Bopara!!
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby sussexpob » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:28 am

Gingerfinch wrote:Amid all this positivity, I still believe there's a place somewhere, for Bopara!!


And that place is Essex
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby Gingerfinch » Wed Jun 10, 2015 9:34 am

sussexpob wrote:
Gingerfinch wrote:Amid all this positivity, I still believe there's a place somewhere, for Bopara!!


And that place is Essex


The only place is Essex.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby budgetmeansbudget » Wed Jun 10, 2015 10:33 am

There was quite a bit of positivity going on after the first test and Stokes' heroics, and then we came crashing back down to earth in the second.

Lets hope the same thing doesn't happen in the second ODI, but there is a fair chance that it will.

For a start Rashid may not have 409 runs to bowl with, not to say he won't rise to the challenge.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby Aidan11 » Wed Jun 10, 2015 10:49 am

After a game like that the only way to go is down.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby budgetmeansbudget » Wed Jun 10, 2015 11:23 am

Aidan11 wrote:After a game like that the only way to go is down.

That was the supposed 'perfect game' for us, never going to play like that again until the next blue moon. Just got to hope that the not so perfect game next time is good enough.
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Re: ODI Series, England v New Zealand, 2015.

Postby KipperJohn » Wed Jun 10, 2015 12:47 pm

hopeforthebest wrote:
Arthur Crabtree wrote:England have dominated bowling first many times. Not so much batting first.

I'm going to try and call it as being a product of it not being part of the Flower/Moores tendency. A team who had identified 320 as a probably winning score just wouldn't have had any reason to score 400 plus.

Root was superb, attacking when everything he has known as an England player would have told him to consolidate. Under Flower/Moores, strategy would have demanded he did consolidate. He would have had to get to 150 after 30 with wickets in hand.


What emphasizes your point AC is that the main core of the team is the one that was so heavily critisizes during the recent WC. Now the Cook issue and the coach have gone the players are more confident to play positively. Whether this is just a one off or a real change we've yet to discover.


Good point hope. Interesting that the two centurions are both established international players and also have the responsibility of VC's in tests and ODIs. As for the Flower/Moores tendency what about Strauss? As Director of Cricket he must have had some influence in this 'new look'?

Pitch must have been a belter - after all Bell scored 90 off 65 balls against Durham on the same ground a few days ago :)

Anyway great stuff and hope the weather holds for the rest of the series - especially Sunday.

I think we know what Root and Buttler can do - the big plus, on this occasion at least, was Rashid.
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