The Ashes; Second Test, Lord's, July 16-20

[sussexpob]

George Dobell on cricinfo haswritten that there are raised eyebrows in the England camp about Rashid ruling himself out due to what Dobell suggests was a very minor soreness on a finger.
He says it's likely he will be made available to play in the Yorks CC game and should he be fit to play his England future hopes could be affected.

Sounds like Flower's England

Bizarre accusation AC..... as if Flower ever treated players like this.... or leaked his private feelings about players to the press

[Arthur Crabtree]

Some light rain on Sunday's forecast. Mostly sunny this morning with light cloud in the afternoon. Hot, sunny day tomorrow.

[hopeforthebest]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

[Arthur Crabtree]

.... or leaked his private feelings about players to the press

Good point.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

There has to be some control in the hand of the groundstaff. Even if limited to how much they roll and the amount of water going into the strip. And how much grass they leave on, and whether that is live or not.

It hasn't been a really dry summer. Anderson said last night that neither the outfield nor the pitch were dry and abrasive, and he expected no reverse swing in the game.

[GarlicJam]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

We often hear groundsmen say things like this, and to some extent we must believe them. However, we must also believe what we see. Was it not greentops last the Indians were in England, followed by low-slows for Aus' last visit. Wickets had life recently - it can't be just the abrasive Australian personalities that deaden them when it comes around to the Ashes.

[hopeforthebest]

There was one over from Anderson yesterday when went around the wicket to Smith and one delivery he tried a yorker on middle and leg which discomforted Smith. Why was that tactic so quickly abandoned I wonder. Plunkett uses similar tactics very often and with success so why didn't Cook get Wood, the quickest bowler, to try it.

[Aidan11]

This would have been a good test for Watson if he played.

He wouldn't get to the crease.

[hopeforthebest]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

We often hear groundsmen say things like this, and to some extent we must believe them. However, we must also believe what we see. Was it not greentops last the Indians were in England, followed by low-slows for Aus' last visit. Wickets had life recently - it can't be just the abrasive Australian personalities that deaden them when it comes around to the Ashes.

That NZ test match was in May when the weather is much softer not in July after 4 weeks of high temperatures.

[sussexpob]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

Ironically, the Indian board wanted the groundsman in question to stop producing the worst pitches known to man, because in the space of two or three tests, there had been 2 x 650, 1 x 550, and 3 x 450 plus scores on it.

[Arthur Crabtree]

There was one over from Anderson yesterday when went around the wicket to Smith and one delivery he tried a yorker on middle and leg which discomforted Smith. Why was that tactic so quickly abandoned I wonder. Plunkett uses similar tactics very often and with success so why didn't Cook get Wood, the quickest bowler, to try it.

Maybe creating rough for Lyon? Also Anderson has had problems with running on the pitch.

[hopeforthebest]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

Ironically, the Indian board wanted the groundsman in question to stop producing the worst pitches known to man, because in the space of two or three tests, there had been 2 x 650, 1 x 550, and 3 x 450 plus scores on it.

Where did you get that from sussex? I remember the time well as it was a big talking point and the old guy was interviewed on TV and was adamant that he was solely in charge.

[sussexpob]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

Ironically, the Indian board wanted the groundsman in question to stop producing the worst pitches known to man, because in the space of two or three tests, there had been 2 x 650, 1 x 550, and 3 x 450 plus scores on it.

Also, I think its pretty easy to deaden a pitch, probably the easiest of results to produce. Over time pitches accumulate dead plant matter (dead grass essentially) that forms a layer of thatch over the surface and deadens the pace in the pitch over time. This is a consequence of all pitches, and you should regularly use a shallow gouge to remove the top layer and reset it if the pitch is slow.... simply dont do that, and you have a pudding.

I mean its common to cover up bowlers foot marks by rolling in organic matter (which is not recommended if you want any kind of pace, but it does happen and is possible)... roll a load of dead plant for 12 days into the pitch and again its dead.

Its the only conclusion you can make because those designs not only slow the pitch but make it bind so it doesnt break up.. the only thing that makes sense in this situation, becuase if pitches are drying too quickly naturally, they break up

[sussexpob]

Can groundsmen really produce pitches to order without making it so plain to see. Surely groundsmen at test venues must have some pride in producing a good pitch. When England were in India in 2012 there was similar talk that India would produce pitches that favoured them but an elderly groundsman said he would produce the pitch his way.

Ironically, the Indian board wanted the groundsman in question to stop producing the worst pitches known to man, because in the space of two or three tests, there had been 2 x 650, 1 x 550, and 3 x 450 plus scores on it.

Where did you get that from sussex? I remember the time well as it was a big talking point and the old guy was interviewed on TV and was adamant that he was solely in charge.

It had become a big deal because Mahkrjee (was that his name) had produced dead and terrible wickets for a few tests, and Dhoni wanted something in the pitch for the spinners. The bloke was convinced he was producing pitches like Perth (despite the runs in previous games) and in the end made a huge issue about being replaced as curator, with the BCCI backing down.

Dhoni took one look at the pitch and said, as many observers agreed with, the pitch was a load of nonsense, England wracked up 550 and won.

[GarlicJam]

I hope Rogers is OK here.

He was lucky not to knowck the ball onto the stumps.