Pakistan v England, limited overs matches. UAE, 2015.

[meninblue]

Virat himself has 23 tons and 34 fifty's in 158 innings. England top 7 cumulative ( Jason, Alex, Joe, Jos, Morgan, Taylor, Moeen) have 22 tons and 62 fifty's in 354 innings.

ABD himself has 23 tons and 47 fifty's in 187 innings. England top 7 cumulative ( Jason, Alex, Joe, Jos, Morgan, Taylor, Moeen) have 22 tons and 62 fifty's in 354 innings.

England are playing good cricket in this ODI series, but to compare them with top ranked teams like Australia, India, South Africa is too much. One top player each of India and South Africa are far ahead of England 's 7 players put together. It shows in team rankings as well

Unfair to compare the World's best limited overs batsmen to six England batsmen who have made their ODI debuts between 6 months and 4 years ago.

Time will tell but the current England ODI batting line up have an enormous amount of potential to achieve what AB and Kohli have done, maybe more.

India and South Africa have two players each who average over 50 !! while having a SR over 89 each except ABD who has SR of 100.

Teams require such high performance players with top class average: SR ratio. England has never had such a player in their lineup. It makes difference and effects the results, ranking etc. Okay, that has not happened in decades but couple of players needs to step up and give such performance. If not in batting then they have to develop players or find ones who excel in other departments by having top class all rounder or top class bowlers.

Also apart from the high performance players, the other players need to have a healthy average: SR ratio in this format.

An individual will consider inexperience, potential etc but the rankings, series wins, world cup wins, average : SR ratio of players will never consider such reasons. What happens practically is more important than what happens in potential at this level.

The likes of Dhoni and Kohli did not become World Class from debut, they honed their skills and learnt their trade whilst collecting a combined 436 ODI caps.

Career averages and strike rates are irrelevant for emerging internationals. 3 years ago Kane Williamson was barely averaging above 30 in Tests and ODIs, now he's become a World Class act. England's new batsmen will have their time at some point.

When Virat and Dhoni were developed India had Sachin and Sehwag as proven high performance players. Not to mention Yuvi who was actually the best ODI cricketer for few years. India could afford to develop players due to high performance players covering up for the new comers. So we could still win 2 World Cups while other players were being developed. England do not have this luxury and they cannot afford to let many players develop in same team, but i agree there is no other option available so they have to accept whatever happens.

England selectors can learn from previous match and they can play Jos in top 3. Only then he will be getting enough overs to score 175+ or 200+. But i doubt if they are going to do that as they are probably satisfied when one players score 140 odd. They won't think about someone giving them a huge ton or double. They may as well laugh at this option But player like Jos will not bat to full potential due to strategy they use.

[Arthur Crabtree]

That's possible. But it's also possible they are giving him the best chance in the role he has. Dhoni was kept mostly at five and six. Yuvraj wasn't batted in the first three. Eventually Buttler will bat at five. Last week, Root was seen as England's best player, and bats at three. We have yet to see the potential of the openers, who are behind Buttler in development, but could be quick scorers.

[meninblue]

That's possible. But it's also possible they are giving him the best chance in the role he has. Dhoni was kept mostly at five and six. Yuvraj wasn't batted in the first three. Eventually Buttler will bat at five. Last week, Root was seen as England's best player, and bats at three. We have yet to see the potential of the openers, who are behind Buttler in development, but could be quick scorers.

Sehwag has one ODI double ton and Sachin one as well. So we had those sort of player who have made big scores. Also when Dhoni got to bat at 3, he made 180+ in some match. Then Rohit has two ODI double tons. Actually given the fitness of Dhoni he could have batted for more balls and he could have scored more hundreds. But in a star studded lineup there was not much to tinker with.

Whereas this is the first time i am certain Jos will be the first English cricketer to have the highest ODI score for England. And England do not have other player who comes across as someone who can make very big score or double. So there is chance for improvement to play with the batting lineup and give it a go. Something that never happened before is now likely to happen.

[ianp1970]

The best thing about this current side is that there are players missing from it that we would usually be clamouring for selection, eg. Stokes & Finn, although at least the calls for Ravi's return have somewhat abated

We are far from the finished product but at there has been progress, and the signs are more promising than for the last 25 years

[Arthur Crabtree]

That's how it looks today Adi, though admittedly it was strange when they kept batting him down at seven. When Root next makes a big score, it'll look different again. Morgs did well recently when Buttler was out of form. Remember that in India (where most of those batting feats took place) the first ten overs represents an opportunity, when the ball is hard. In England, it can be better for the bowlers, though admittedly, that can change with the conditions. At least England promoted him the other day, and well done to Morgs for that.

[Arthur Crabtree]

Good to see Buttler back in form.

[Aidan11]

Still think he should stick to shorter formats and Bairstow play in the tests.

[dan08]

Don't really see what Bairstow can do that Buttler can't.

Bairstow just isn't good enough.

[Making_Splinters]

Given the ODIs are done for 2015, its hard to think that less than 12 months ago England were humiliated at the World Cup. We have a side that has scored the highest ever team total by an English side and have gone to 350 in just under a quarter of their games. We have a side where all of the top 7 have ODI tons to their names. We have a seen the fastest ODI ton record by an English player broken twice.

The remarkable turn around since Moores and Cook left the scene is breath taking. If England can keep going at this rate they'll be amongst the best ODI sides in the world this time next year.

[Durhamfootman]

we can only hope

[Slipstream]

20/20 team ?

Hales
Roy
Morgan
Buttler
Root
Ali
Billings
Willey
Woakes
Rashid
Topley

[greyblazer]

If Buttler can work on his footwork, he can succeed in Test cricket, too.

[meninblue]

That's how it looks today Adi, though admittedly it was strange when they kept batting him down at seven. When Root next makes a big score, it'll look different again. Morgs did well recently when Buttler was out of form. Remember that in India (where most of those batting feats took place) the first ten overs represents an opportunity, when the ball is hard. In England, it can be better for the bowlers, though admittedly, that can change with the conditions. At least England promoted him the other day, and well done to Morgs for that.

Agree that Morgan has promoted Jos a few times in both short formats in some matches that i saw.

[backfootpunch]

Buttler isn't a number three

He is a six hitter not a proper batsmen and belongs in the lower middle order, he is the best finisher we have and the highest he should bat is 5

Root is clearly the better option at 3, a batsmen who can make 130 off 100 balls and 100 off 130 which ever way the situation requires

If I was captain I would send buttler in whenever we lose a wicket after the 30th over, let him get to 30 off 30 balls before the last ten

[Making_Splinters]

The argument about where Buttler should bat is a complete red herring. ODI batting line ups should be flexible and suit each players strengths. South Africa have two of the most complete middle order batsmen in world cricket in Du Plessis and De Villiers. Faf is arguably better at steadying the ship but can go big, AB is the most destructive middle order batsman in world cricket. How do South Africa balance these two? They bat AB at five, despite being the best ODI batsman in the world because it means that more times than not he will be coming in to bat in a situation that lets him play with abandon and destroy a bowling attack.

England have a top 6 who all bring different skills to the game, particularly in the middle order. Root can score tons but generally isn't going to get there at a strike rate much over 120, he is however the perfect player to steady the innings and bat long. Taylor and Morgan fall somewhere in the middle, both can bat long but are capable of scoring quicker than Root. Buttler is at the opposite end of the spectrum to Root. He's at his best whe he can come in with a platform and play his natural game without the worry that getting out will derail the side. That's not to say he is incapable of playing a solid knock to get the side over the line, he's just better at turning the decent score into a big score. Finally Ali is very much at the far end of this, he's someone you want with 5 overs to go and to hit the ball as hard as he can.

When the best time for these five to come in depends entirely on the match situation, you wouldn't want Buttler to come in at 10 for 1 in the second over, equally you don't really want Root coming in at 150 for 1 in the 30th over. What England have started to show is a realisation that they can move their batsmen around to make the most of each one of their strengths, such as Morgan promoting Buttler up the order in the last ODI.

It's not a perfect science, sometimes Buttler will be wasted coming in with 5 overs left, but it is a damn site better than those suggesting we should arbitrarily stick Buttler at 3 or 4 and ignore the state of the game. A general plan like, Backfoot says works well. You want the likes of Buttler and Morgan to come in with 20 overs to go.

What makes this England side so exciting is you have 7 batsmen all of whom can score tons but all have different ways of getting there unlike in the past when England were pretty much stuck with hoping KP or Morgan would fire to get them to 300. As Morgan and the squad get more experiance playing with each other, when to send someone in will become more and more refined, but, the answer isn't to revert to hard and fast batting positions.

Long story short, doesn't matter if Jos is carded to bat 3 or 9 if Morgan and England continue to develop their flexible approach to batting and when is best to use each of the resources in the side.