Ashes 2021-22.

[Durhamfootman]

accepted at England HQ.

they have their eyes on a different prize

[alfie]

Hardly dared to come on here after that...

I did fear after last night something like this could happen. Must say I thought it would be Starc and Cummins with all the wickets rather than Boland though !

Bizarre and rather sad end to what was a very interesting match for the first two days.

Hats off to the Aussies. Got on top , resisted the fightback , and then completely broke England with the ball in that second innings. Ruthless and totally professional

But that limp finish is going to make it even harder for this demoralized England outfit to put up any resistance in Sydney and Hobart. Honestly don't know what I would say to them if I were in Joe Root's position. They have to play the games anyway - can't say I envy them as their minds must be pretty shattered by this.

Will leave it there I think. I don't have much taste for hand wringing or kicking people when they're down.

[Arthur Crabtree]

I was expecting some token resistance. But looking at Boland's figures it looks like England ran into Curtly Ambrose.

I was thinking lowest point since Trinidad 1994. But there was Kingston 2009, Aukland 2018 (58, of which Overton made 33 at nine), Leeds v Aus in 2019 (England won!), all worse in numbers. As a series, Pakistan in 2012 seemed worse.

England have been bowled out for under 100 five times in the last three years!

Well done you Aussies!

[sussexpob]

The positive thing is, I expect finally the authorities to witness this and be on board. Just a shame it seems to take a 5-0 batter in Oz before any administrator asks difficult questions

were questions asked last time (albeit 4-0) or the time before?

the only time they asked questions was after 06/07. Since the Mitchwash I rather think it has just become expected and accepted at England HQ. Doubtless they'll bluster for a bit for appearances sake, but nothing will happen other than lip service and a bit of fiddling around the edges

While you can decide yourself on what the difference between "leave" and "fired" means, after 13-14....

Downton replaced Hugh Morris as MD
Collier was replaced by Harrison as CEO
Flower was sacked/left as Test coach
Giles was sacked as ODI/T20I coach
Geoff Miller resigned pre-series and was slated to be replaced by Whitaker as chairman of selectors. Fraser and another (can't remember who) came onto the panel as county scouts/experts
Graham Gooch left/sacked as batting coach
David Saker accepted a contract in the Big Bash the following winter and ran his contract down for the summer
Several players careers were finished, or as good as finished.

Only Clarke and Cook survived really....Clarke did so because he was making dollars

[Durhamfootman]

I have no doubt players, coaches and administrators will pay for the debacle, SP, but replacing people is unlikely to change very much without some pretty far reaching reform of the structures that led to an entire generation of county batsmen being generally unfit for purpose at test level

I can think of a better wicketkeeper who could come in immediately after this tour is finished, but I can't think of any batsmen who are very obviously better than this lot. Lets face it, pretty much every top 3 batsman in county cricket has had a crack of nailing down a top 3 spot for the England team and no-one has succeeded.... you know when Stoneman gets umpteen chances as a test opener that England have already scraped the bottom of the barrel. It'll take a few years to get another barrel even with more essential change than will actually take place

Colly needs to first hope that Silverwood isn't deemed culpable enough to warrant sacking (an unrealistic hope, I'd imagine... CS might have been given rubbish tools to work with but with his decisions around rotation, amongst others, he's definitely made the least of what he did get) and then Colly needs to keep his head down for the next 5 years or so in the hope that any reputation he might have as an effective leader with an excellent cricketing brain doesn't get ruined by being shoved into the poisoned chalice position of England head coach before any reformation takes place.... if indeed any does

[Arthur Crabtree]

When Strauss was employed by the ECB, it was released to favoured journalists that his job was to prioritise limited overs cricket ahead of Tests. Mission accomplished.

[Durhamfootman]

indeed

[Arthur Crabtree]

Just read a quote from an anonymous ECB coach that the ECB tells its coaches not to try and 'correct' natural technique. Maybe that's a response to players like Steve Smith who succeed through unorthodox methods. It'd be interesting to know who issued the edict, a former player or an administrator.

[sussexpob]

I remain positive that this will lead to changes. The money driven ECB can't flog a dead product for much longer, and will realise their long term cash trail comes from success....a success that is built from a healthy county system.

Too long the separation of national team and county, made on the divide of revenue, has ignored the fact that the England team who make all the cash are a by product of everything below it.

Those in charge of administration has been narrow minded and will pay for their jobs. Guys like Harrison pushing the hundred to a fan base totally agnostic to it are already on thin ground.

And as far as the direct team management goes, yes I sympathise ...but even given their lot, it's hard to accept they've justified their positions.

Draw a line under it and start again. I would happily allow things to get worse taking a long term vision building to a future, then trying to patch the numerous holes.

[sussexpob]

Call it a personal preference too, but I've never subscribed to the idea of "well what's the alternative" when the current is clearly not working.

Maybe there is no one around who can make this team better...... That's unknown. What is known is the majority of this side are proven to be not good enough. So you have to try.

I remember a time Steve Smith was a spinner with a penchant for bowling long hops....out of nowhere he became the best averaging batsman since Bradman. When England dropped to their worst ever, players stepped up from nowhere.

It probably fails, but may as well fail doing something different then repeating the same.

[Durhamfootman]

get test cricket back from behind the paywall and stop test cricketers spending the little bit of red ball time available to them in the county championship ahead of the first test series, playing T20 cricket in the IPL. 2 very obvious things that could be done to improve the health of the game before they have to start thinking about the complicated stuff.

[yuppie]

Since England don't take touring ashes series all the serious now, perhaps Australia could look to reduce the series to 3 test matches. Maybe look to give the boxing days tests to India and NZ every 2 years.

I thought Wood bowled well and with out much luck on the second day.

England batting in the first inings lost their 3 most experienced bats to poor shots, and then with Australia at 6 for 180 the England bowlers had bought their team back into it. But once again they could not finish it off and Australia's last 4 added 87 runs. 19 more runs than Englands 2nd innings. Cricket is a game of what ifs, but from nearly having a slender deficit to loosing by an innings is just amazing.

Or another way to put it, Marcus Harris scored more runs than Englands second innings. Thats bad.

Australia should be commended though, the fight from the tail with the bat, and then the last hour on the second day set the tone. Starc dismissing Stokes in the morning with a peach of a ball got rid of any hope. But it was a ball worthy of the occasion.

Australia have bought in 3 bowlers for this series and all have performed well. Boland makes an great story and his ability to put the ball in the right place was just to much for England.

In no way is this Australia a great team, but their are some great players in it. Cummins and Smith are generational cricketers, and the bowling attack is worthy of many accolades. I think most cricket fans would like to have seen them playing a better team than the one this England team have produced.

[sussexpob]

Despite us being terrible on Ashes tours, we have still won a series 10 years more recently away than Australia......



I don't know if that first paragraph was a bit of a fishing expedition Yuppie, but the fact is the Ashes generate the cash, and plenty of articles around pre-series were predicting the Aussie Boards utter financial ruin if England didn't tour (50 mill loss in covid times I believe I read). If anything, the Aussie should be very happy England accepted to tour under tough conditions and uncertainties, and talk of lessening tests is pretty silly to me...... (As any host nation in this dire time should be, I make no exception for anyone, all touring teams should be applauded for working in these conditions).

In fact I read an article somewhere in the mainstream press lamenting the ECB for being way too accommodating in the end. The ECB could have totally screwed the cash strapped Aussie board by holding them hostage for all types of demands in order to play....the ECB instead played a straight bat and did everything they could to fulfill the schedule as planned.

[GarlicJam]

In no way is this Australia a great team, but their are some great players in it. Cummins and Smith are generational cricketers, and the bowling attack is worthy of many accolades.

It is not too different a team to the one that was rolled by an understrength India less than 12 months ago. We'd struggle to name a 'great' team that has such a flaky opener/unsettled opening pairing.

They are a better team than 12 months ago, due to the experience that the likes of Head and Green have had since - and hopefully they all learned from the India experience - and due to them having to blood new bowlers. Green coming along as a test bowler is also really helping their bowling stocks. They are a very good fielding side, and a very good bowling side - although playing England right now has probably made them look better than they really are.

What really helped Aus was all the replacement bowlers hitting their straps, having luck, as soon as they entered test cricket. Boland's debut is Boys' Own stuff.

I would like to see an India tour of Aus start about now.

[yuppie]

Firmly tongue in cheek SP. More my thoughts in the way the ECB see test cricket tours. I don't think they will change anything either. They'll sack some people, make some noise about change and then go and celebrate the 100 next summer. And a T 20 cup and do their best at making cricket like the premier league.

England are on course to loose 2 test series in Australia 5-0 and the only people that really care are us test fans. And the ECB are not courting us. Australia will continue to at least focus on some red ball cricket, as will India and NZ by the looks of things. The Ashes in Australia will become as one sided as the bledisloe cup has done for NZ.

Australia were just one competent umpire away from winning a series in England

Australia last year against India eventually got let down by their tired bowlers in the 4th test. Last year there was no depth in the bowling ranks and by Brisbane they were bowled out other than Cummins. This team is probably better placed in that Green bowls better now and the back up bowlers are not injured at present. The batting is still not great and i don't think it has improved. Englands batting is bad, and their bowling is average. This Australian batting line up would not make any where near as many runs against India. Especially is Smith is not performing at his best. I think in the future looking back at this ashes team we will remember the Australian bowling but not the batters.