World Cup 2026

[Durhamfootman]

I'm looking at the score

I'm looking at the time

and I'm looking at the line up

and I'm not sure if we're at least 3 centres back short

[Gingerfinch]

Rice has found some energy

[Gingerfinch]

3-0

I don't normally enjoy friendlies but this could have been 5-2 so far

[bigfluffylemon]

Well that was crazy.

Mixed feelings about it. On the one hand, we finally beat a top 10 opposition in a competitive game, and it's England's best finish since 1966 in a WC. On the other hand, it was competitive in name only, as no one cares about 3rd place, and it showed - how different it was when the shackles were off compared to the fear of losing the semi that ironically was England's downfall. We might well ask where that spirit was in that game (and where Saka was, for that matter...)?

[Durhamfootman]

I'm still trying to process that, tbh

Brilliant in the first half against a France side with 4 of the usual starting XI missing, but still a quality side. Terrible for large periods of the second half after France brought those 4 players on at HT. Found the edge, late in the game

It seems to me that, with the exception of the opening game against Croatia, against the better teams England generally did pretty well in the first 45 but then lost control in the second. I'm still unsure as to why. I suppose it's entirely possible that in the KO stages, the relentless travel, the excessive heat, the altitude changes and the gruelling matches all meant that England got tired in those second 45's. It's equally possible that I'm making excuses for them and it's actually a mental barrier that has been developing for as long as I can remember. Freezing on the biggest stages, the biggest games. Tuchel was supposed to be the answer to that, but nothing really changed.

However, I was worried about whether his decisions in the semi final might change his standing with the players, but this game will surely have restored any faith that the players may have lost in him, because he largely made the right changes and England got over the line in a thriller. There's still a lot of work to do, because had Spain or Argentina found themselves 4-0 up against that French team last night, I doubt France would have managed to nearly rescue the game.

I sound churlish, grudging even. It was a very enjoyable game

[Durhamfootman]

If i had to pick the England player who impressed me the most this tournament, and I wasn't allowed to pick Bellingham, then I'd probably say Djed Spence. He has looked from the outside to have been a kind of Tuchel project, but whenever he came on he looked the part and last night I thought he was terrific. He's made a big claim to be England's first choice LB, if you ask me.

And maybe that's part of the disappointment with the campaign... whenever he came on. So many positions in the side seem to be in a state of flux... is it Gordon or is it Rashford? Is it Saka (it should be, but wasn't always) or is it Madueke.... or Rogers for crying out loud? Is it James or Quansah or Konsa? These were questions going into the tournament that were never answered. Bellingham or Rogers was the only question answered and I think most of us knew the answer to that anyway

I would have no idea before matches which XI were likely to start for England. Argentina have a very settled first XI, Spain and France would only ever have one or two changes in their starting XI's, but with England only really Pickford, Rice, Anderson, Bellingham and Kane were certain starters. Partly that was through injury, but partly it was because the squad was very strange, made stranger by the non replacement of Livramento. It meant changes all around to cover for the absence of a recognised right back. There was a lot of muddled thinking from a man with an elite manager reputation who would help England take the next step

[alfie]

Obviously the "Bronze Medal" match was never going to excite everyone like the serious route to the Cup... but I have to say it was a wonderfully entertaining game to watch !

And in a perverse way I didn't actually mind France making their spirited comeback as it added a sense of drama - and purpose - to what might have been a bit of a lack-lustre victory lap in the second half. And also tested England (and Tuchel) to make sure they didn't throw away what the first half had earned. Pleased there was no retreat into a defensive posture ... and they got the job done in some style. Very fitting Jude finished it off

Third instead of 4th isn't a huge difference but it is a nicer way to finish (even if it teases more "what might have been" ) Worth a fair bit of prize money too I understand.

Agree with DFM about Spence. And that the effect on Manager/playing group relations may have benefited.

So a few good things coming in a few hours :see rugby (take that , Argentina !) and athletics ...

[sussexpob]

So at that break Tuchel had a choice to make : supply fresh legs and instruct the players to go after another score (remember at this stage Argentina had two centre backs on yellow cards) : or do what he did ... pull up the drawbridge in the hopes of somehow repelling an opponent who had shown amazing ability to score late goals throughout the tournament and were blessed with one of the all time greats - for a further 30 minutes . Good luck with that

England's front 6 attacking players touched the ball 14 times in total between them between England going 1-0 up and Argentina going 2-1 up. Man City, the best producer of key chances/XG/highest scoring team in the PL this year required require 55 touches per key chance created, and 7,72 key chances to score, this being by far and away the best attacking performance in the league. Put into perspective, for the best case scenario PL attacking side to score a goal, they need 30 times more of the ball than England's attacking players got during that phase of the game. That's on average across 38 games, and not even taking into account opposition strength where those numbers would go up playing a world champion.

"Instructing players to go after another score" in this scenario is basically like that scene in Downfall where Hitler is asking his generals to attack with armies that only exist in his mind.... Outside of any of these front 6 players control, those behind them could not get them the ball. They touched it 14 times between them, so your "go get me a goal" speech in reality is asking a player who is going to touch the ball once every 20 minutes if they are lucky somehow make that touch something special, even when the XA/XG is not even a fraction of a percent. You are basically asking for miracles.

I mean, given the one touch of the ball he received in the time period, do you want 3 time consecutive FIFA Pro World XI selectee Bellingham or Eze on the ball? Do you want "one key pass all year" Mainoo over CL midfielder of the year Rice? Or the most expensive midfielder ever in Anderson? Maybe you think Rashford would have done better with his one touch back to goal 20 yards from our own goalline than Gordon, but Barcelona don't think so as they just paid 3.5 times the money to replace Rashford with Gordon. Why not replace the Ballon D'or favourite with a guy playing in the 30th best league in world football, Toney I am sure would have created or bagged a goal from the touch he had every 10 minutes. Or maybe we can put on Madueke, ranked England's worst player in the previous two matches on BBC polls, for England's most expensive footballer in history.... he did nothing in 5 games, but I am sure given 3 touches this half he'd have won us the game, right?

Well no. If you can't get the ball to your forwards, then it matters little who the hell is on the field. England had their best 6 objective players on, not sure how inferior players getting 1/2 touches in a half suddenly makes it change. The problem was further back.

[sussexpob]

Unsurprising to see Sussex on to play Devil's advocate . Not that I think Tuchel is The Devil , by the way - just a bit of a disappointment on this occasion. But I'm not buying all that

I dont feel like its a radical idea. Suggesting changing attackers when the problem is the attackers can't get the ball, is a bit like changing the engine of a formula 1 car when you forgot to put on the wheels. The car isn't moving whatever engine it has in it.

Tuchel had two realistic options. The first was to concede England could not make a pass in their own final third, which was the reality, and to defend the consequences of that. The second would have been to change goalie or those players incapable of passing out the back, but this was our weakest area on the pitch. Spence was playing well, so O' Reilly wouldn't have come on. Our right back options were not fully fit all tournament and Quansah was suspended. You are left with musing Henderson is better technically than Pickford, or Burn than Guehi, which in both cases is not objectively an argument.

Any other solution would have been a straight gamble not taking the strength of players or their techniques into account. And I dont think anyone wants a manager ignoring all data and throwing on whatever.

He took option 1.... probably the best of terrible options. But a manager can't be blamed for his players being unable to string 2 passes together.

[mikesiva]

Spain 2-0 France

A brilliant defensive performance. Peaking at the right time.

Spain did it again. Completely shut out Argentina to zero chances on goal.

Rodri player of the tournament for me.

[Gingerfinch]

Spain were the only team trying to win and got their rewards. Argentina sitting back from the first minute with no pace up front wasn't likely to work. I had Argentina in the sweepstake, so was hoping they would win but they were never going to.

[Durhamfootman]

Argentina!

gracious in defeat

they are a disgusting set. Paredes swinging punches, Otamendi in people's faces

crawl back into your holes.... you're a disgrace

[alfie]

The best team won so no complaints about this WC - though I would obviously have liked England to have made the final.(They would surely have lost it but almost certainly provided a better spectacle than Argentina )

No respect to Argentina for the way they played and their behaviour afterwards. Messi is a great player but in that team I shed no tears for his (presumably finishing in WCs) on a sour note.

[Gingerfinch]

The England players would have watched last night's game and wondered how they lost to Argentina. I believe Southgate would have taken us over the line, although Spain would have been one step too far!

[Gingerfinch]

The best team won so no complaints about this WC - though I would obviously have liked England to have made the final.(They would surely have lost it but almost certainly provided a better spectacle than Argentina )

No respect to Argentina for the way they played and their behaviour afterwards. Messi is a great player but in that team I shed no tears for his (presumably finishing in WCs) on a sour note.

I felt sorry for Messi, having to play with those animals and more importantly not so great players.